تدريب Shadowing: AI vs Humans: Who’s more creative? What in the World podcast, BBC World Service - تعلم التحدث بالإنجليزية مع YouTube

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People are writing music with AI as a tool or even as a co-collaborator, if you like.

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People are writing music with AI as a tool or even as a co-collaborator, if you like.

I think one of the main reasons why a lot of artists are still very skeptical to use AI at the moment is because of its copyright issues.

The future of creative writing, of literature, is human, not AI.

Hey, it's Iqra and this is What in the World from the BBC World Service.

So it won't be news to you guys, a lot of us are using AI these days, when we need a bit of creative inspiration to come up with that cool caption, maybe figure out the perfect playlist.

It's something we were chatting about on the team earlier, that link between AI and creativity, what it actually means to be creative, whether AI can make us more creative.

We're going to get into all sides of the debate today. Let's get into it.

So one person who had some of the biggest thoughts on this on the team is this man right here, Rio from the What in the World team. Hey, Rio.

Hey. How are you? I'm not bad.

Before we get any further, I need to figure out. Are you a creative?

How creative are you? Good question.

Personally, I would say I'm a creative, but not in the traditional sense.

Most people throw the term around and think of poets, musicians.

But me personally, I really enjoy editing videos and coming up with cool concepts and soundscapes.

Funnily enough, I was on Instagram the other day and I was just scrolling through as you do, and an advert for an AI editing tool popped up, and it really got me thinking, how many other people are using this tool to edit?

Because when I edit, it takes me hours.

And that's how I kind of fell down this rabbit hole of how creative AI is making us.

And it was really interesting because I read a report published by The Economist that estimates 16% of workers globally are using generative AI monthly.

Think chatbots like ChatGPT or Copilot.

But a quick scroll through YouTube, and you can see people using it to produce music, to also edit and come up and brainstorm different ideas.

And it's completely understandable. This tool is very, very effective.

But personally, the part of the editing process that I enjoy the most is cracking the code.

It feels like an achievement at the end and using AI bypasses that completely.

Okay, well, you sound very creative.

I think I'm a little bit of a creative as well. I'll take that hat.

But when we're saying creativity, what are we meaning here?

How would you define creativity? It's quite a loose term, isn't it?

Definitely. And it's quite a confusing term too, because like I mentioned, most people think of poets, musicians, but most people would generally define it as the ability to create new and unique ideas.

And of course, our definition constantly evolves throughout time.

It's not a static definition. There's a test called the Alternative Use Test, and it was created by an American psychologist.

And it measures levels of creativity.

And it does that by asking us to name different ways to use an object, for instance, a tennis ball.

And we're given a minute to come up with different uses for that tennis ball.

I'm rubbish at these things.

So if you're listening from home, feel free to join in.

I'll essentially name an object and you will have to come up with different uses for that object.

And we all have a minute to come up with something.

So I've set a timer and the words or the object is a skateboard.

Ah, I'm already panicking. I'm already panicking.

Skateboard. Skateboard. Why don't you go first?

Oh, okay. A kateboard.

I would say you could use it to move a fridge.

I'm not sure if it's strong enough. Okay, I'm going to use it as a foot rest. A foot rest. Ooh. Nice.

I would say something to eat your dinner off of.

Okay. Oh, I was just about to say that - I'm going to say.

I'm going to say, put my books on.

Nice. A skateboard. You could use it to break a window!

Oh, I ran out of ideas. I'm sorry.

Maybe I'm not as great as creative as I thought I was.

Yeah, well, it's super, super challenging.

But now I'm going to use a chatbot the same question to see how many ideas it can come up with. So let's see.

So the results are in and it's come up with - oh it's still going.

We've got 16, 17, 18, 19, 20.

Some of them that's coming up, something to move heavy boxes or furniture.

Kind of similar to my idea.

A kinetic teaching aid to explain friction and momentum.

Okay. Would you have come up with that? Yeah.

So this test really simply illustrates why people are turning to this technology because it can enhance our creativity.

But, and a big but, if we just use this technology by a simple prompt, we're missing out on the fun process.

Like we had a massive joke there.

It was nice to make mistakes. When I did this previously, it came up with 120 alternative uses in about ten seconds flat.

Yes, and that would be hard for us to do.

Very hard. I'm not capable of that. We just about got four.

So obviously tools like that, AI is being used more and more in our daily lives. And I know, you know, speaking about this in relation to creativity, you've been speaking to some creatives, a musician, a poet, hearing from both sides of the debate.

So let's start with the negative aspects of it.

Why do some people think it's bad for creativity?

That's a really interesting question.

And of course most people have different opinions for why it's bad.

That can range from concerns around originality, concerns about copyright, and fears of being replaced.

But I want to focus on originality.

I actually spoke to a Nigerian poet named Ridwan Fasasi and he made a really fascinating, a few fascinating points.

So let's hear from him now.

So for me, I want to highlight specifically that when it comes to creative writing, the future of creative writing, of literature is human, not AI, even though some people might have a different opinion to that.

But for me, as a writer, as a poet, I believe that the originality, when we want to tell our stories, we want to give our literature, we want to write our prose, our short stories, our poetry, our drama.

We need this authenticity. We need this originality.

And AI can give us that originality we want.

Because what makes us unique as human is the fact that we-there is diverse emotions, there is diverse opinions on things.

So we want to see people that brings these different opinions to us, to tell us their story, to tell us how they feel about something.

So, as you heard, Fasasi made some really interesting points, and there is a lot of agreement online that AI lacks originality and just a reminder for our audience and for yourself, AI works by mining the internet for data, which essentially means any of the content it generates isn't original.

It isn't boundary pushing. It's not new.

You can think of AI as essentially not being able to create from its own experience.

Rather, it reconfigures what already exists.

But there is a massive philosophical debate at hands, because how original are we in our creations and ideas?

I'm sure many people have heard of the expression that there's no such thing as a new idea, and that was popularised by an American writer, Mark Twain.

More famously, Pablo Picasso has been known to say, good artists copy, but great artists steal. And this essentially speaks to the point that there's nothing quite new under the sun.

However, Fasasi's point specifically about authenticity is the the dividing point, rather the most important point, because what differentiates us from AI is that we have life experiences, we have emotions, and that's our unique selling point.

And that's something AI can't take from us and can't replicate.

Authenticity is at the core of creative work.

Yeah, it's good to hear Fasasi's points on originality and AI there.

Of course, we know that some creatives are worried about AI and how it's going to affect their work, their job security.

Just tell us a little bit about that. You're absolutely right.

People are concerned for a lot of different reasons.

Firstly, I'll start with concerns over the fear of being replaced.

Only a few years ago, we had the Hollywood strikes, and actors and writers were in uproar over studios incorporating AI into their work. But what did we see?

Through their strikes, the industry had to pivot and control how AI was used specifically around writing scripts.

Secondly, there are some concerns about copyright.

So I've also heard from Veda, an animator from Hong Kong.

Let's listen to what she had to say. I think one of the main reasons why a lot of artists are still very skeptical to use AI at the moment is because of its copyright issues.

A lot of times, AI would steal from artwork from the internet made by actual artists, and then train it to its own model when the original artist didn't agree to do so.

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There are also many cases where people just claim AI work to be their own, which to an untrained eye it can be quite hard to tell.

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And the last couple of years in the animation industry, at least, a lot of artists are getting laid off and a lot of fresh grads, even from the top art schools, aren't able to secure any creative jobs.

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And I think AI did play a huge role in that, along with many other reasons.

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I just hope that people, artists in the future generation will keep drawing, keep creating because creativity is one of the best tools to express yourselves and that is really important.

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Just to sum up a bit, in this negative side of AI affecting creativity, we've heard the arguments against, we're truly the you know, we're the original ones in all of this.

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And then that point about how it's maybe affecting job security for some people.

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Those are the negatives, but not everyone is against it.

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AI can be a really powerful tool as well.

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How do some people use it creatively?

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You're absolutely right. During my research, I came across so many interesting ways people are starting to use AI quite creatively.

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One example that I mentioned previously is that people are using it to streamline their content creation.

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Say for instance, through video editing software, whereas others are using it as a soundboard to brainstorm different ideas.

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I actually spoke to a really interesting guy called Manon, who's a music producer, and he's worked with really big names like Idris Elba, Will.i.am. Let's listen to what he had to say.

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I know today in a lot of my sessions, if I'm making music or in a lot of the sessions that, you know, friends of mine would be in, that AI is playing a big part in those, in those sessions, you know, people are writing music with AI, as a tool or even as a co-collaborator, if you like, bouncing around ideas, finding, you know, new ways of writing a progression or a piece of music and yeah, it's become a central part of a lot of people's creative process.

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Okay. So I'm going to put you on the spot here.

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Oh, gosh. Okay. Answer in one word. And why.

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Will AI kill creativity?

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No. And the why is because because I feel that humans are innately creative.

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And it's a thing that we have to do.

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We have to scratch the itch. And I think we're always a step ahead in terms of being able to imagine a different future.

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AI today is trained on stuff that we've already imagined, so that's an interesting way to look at it.

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Manon made some really great points.

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For instance, starting to use AI as a co-creator, a collaborator.

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I can relate to that in the sense that if I wanted to make a song instead of using or rather relying on dozens of people to write the lyrics, produce the melodies, I could just bounce ideas off of AI.

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This technology is making creative spaces much more accessible, whereas in the past there were traditional barriers like manpower, the different skills necessary in the team, or millions of pounds necessary in the budget to create creative pieces of work, that's no longer necessary.

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And experts actually call this process the democratisation of creativity, because those barriers are very quickly being erased.

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And so that's been really good to hear.

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But we know AI is changing and evolving all the time.

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There isn't widespread legislation on how creatives can use AI as part of their work at the moment.

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But we do know there's a rise on some platforms of AI generated labels.

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So that label is there, and it's often a symbol of trust.

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You know how the content is made when you can see that AI generated label, often in red caps. So it'll be interesting to see in the future how that kind of the technology continues to evolve, but also how the legislation around this evolves and how that affects creatives as well.

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Rio, I knew you were the big thinker on the team.

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That's been so interesting to hear all sides of the debate.

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Thank you for bringing them here. Thank you so much for having me Iqra.

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And I'm going to throw that question to you guys too.

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Is AI killing our creativity?

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Remember you can comment below. Like and subscribe.

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I'm Iqra, this is What in the World from the BBC World Service and we'll see you next time. Bye.

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