Shadowing Practice: Ariana Grande Part 1 (Full Episode) | Shut Up Evan Podcast - Learn English Speaking with Video

Shut up, Evan.

Nailed it.

He's here.

Ariana Grande, thank you so much for being here.

Thank you so much.

Welcome back.

Thank you.

You are the first three-time guest on Shut Up, Evan.

What?

Yeah, because we did that little Met Gullivan.

For the live-ay.

Yeah.

Yes.

Oh my god, I'm honored.

I'm honored.

So very happy to have you.

Thank you for having me again.

There's a million things to talk about.

I want to jump right in with this movie, Wicked For Good.

Yes.

I think the announcement of your casting came in November 2021.

From start to finish, this journey has been about four years, which is such a long block of time.

Yeah.

And so I'm wondering, when you look back on the whole, we just were touching down on the press tour of film one, which is like, but a segment of this journey.

A blip.

Yeah.

And then there are obviously the films themselves, right?

There's the rehearsal process, there's the filming process, all of it.

Now at this finish line, which it feels so, I imagine it feels weird for me,

it must feel weird for you to be able to talk about this experience retroactively for the first time.

When you look at this, if you are able to, zoom out on the whole of it, what has this done for you, not as a performer, not professionally,

take that out of it, but Ariana?

Oh gosh.

Ugh.

I guess it's, I mean, it's so much, first of all.

It's really emotional.

Like, just being here, here, you know, this is the final one.

This is kind of like a moment that came so quickly and we didn't, you know, anticipate.

And it's, you know, I don't feel the thing where I want to go back.

Like, I don't need, I don't think I need more time there being Glinda.

I think that I'm very at peace with Glinda.

But you're right, looking at it like this is really emotional.

It's done so much for Ariana.

It has totally rearranged everything about my relationship to creating.

I didn't think I was going to make an album ever again

when I left for London and that was kind of my secret, but I didn't think I was going to, you know.

It's, I mean, obviously you can take the hat off and be not in character when you go home for the day, but you take the feelings home,

and performing the act of Glinda, who's so sure of herself,

and so, you know, even when the decisions are hard, I think that kind of,

I remember early in the process, process unpacking that a lot with my therapist because my brain really liked it.

You know, she had a connection to her gut that I think I kind of lost through trauma.

It happens with trauma.

That's okay.

But our work is to kind of like reconnect that.

And I think through the act of performing it and Glinda's certainty and Glinda's belief in herself totally ignited something,

a strength in me that I missed, you know, that I really really needed.

So I learned a lot from her as a character who learns

so much over the course of these two films

and has to look at herself in the mirror constantly

and sort of peel away at the pieces of her that don't feel aligned.

So I do think that I was kind of forced to do that alongside her.

And also just from the people that I got to do this with.

I learned so much.

You know, John, at the head of that, I don't have enough time.

Like, there are no words to describe what an incredible leader he is.

And he's empathy personified.

You know, I've never seen someone with higher stakes on their,

you know, being placed on their being handled with such ease

and grace and kindness and respect and yeah reminds me of my grandpa

and how he ran his business and it felt like

that you know I always respected my grandpa

so much as like the number one person and I feel like they are adjacent in that way.

I'm wondering about the idea of like the ensemble nature of working on a film versus when you're on tour, it's you.

They are coming to see Ariana Grande perform.

And with this, this is an ensemble.

What was that like in terms of artistically to be a part of something where you are a piece of something?

That's the best part of it.

Oh my God, sorry, I didn't mean to cut you off.

No, please.

No, that was like the best part of it.

Because not only are you not, you're not telling your own story, first of all.

I'm not using, I don't use, I'm not using my own pain on screen.

I'm using Glinda's.

So there's that element.

And then there's also the part where like you're just a tiny piece of this puzzle and you're all serving it together.

You're all serving the thing that's bigger than everybody, which is wicked.

And we all get to be a part of that.

It's so beautiful.

Whereas I do feel like when it comes to tour and music, it is so self-focused.

You know, it's singularly about the artist.

And I think that that wears on my soul sometimes especially

because there's like the caricaturized version of me that is

that the artist you know

and um what the songs are about versus what people take them for versus perception

and whatever you know it's nice to give the soul a break

and to disappear into a different character because i do feel like that's somewhat of a caricaturization and it's like

yeah not only do you get to take a break from your own stories

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and pain and songs and things and and isms

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but you get to create something beautiful with a beautiful group of people

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and serve this piece together while wearing someone else's clothes Jason Robert Brown I love

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that album so good that's the one with the Lilius White track at the end, People Coming Together I think is the song?

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I think so.

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Yeah.

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You two, more stuff with the two of you together.

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Willing it into existence.

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Cause we have your Still Hurting on YouTube, Craving Your CM Smiling.

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Oh my goodness.

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Just saying.

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Okay, now seems like that you had a different press strategy going into this film than last time.

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Strategy?

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Strategy.

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Well, sorry go on.

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Wait I feel like there's more to the question.

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There is, but because it's like, Never could you have imagined, or I don't think you could have imagined, maybe you could have, the amount of,

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the intensity of this press run, this last go-round.

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I mean, I think that you both created sort of a new paradigm with which a press tour can be,

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just because every effing thing that you two did became a thing.

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Well, I wish that for some of the things that I still see come up, that we could provide context.

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Like, there are so many clips that you would understand if you were there and you felt like,

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first of all, I loved that experience.

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We had a really beautiful time.

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But with the second one, we've been filming.

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I've been filming here and she's been filming in London.

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So I'm wrapping Fockers on Halloween and going straight into, I'm flying straight to Brazil.

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We're starting the press tour three days later.

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It's not necessarily a strategy as much as it's logistically been a little difficult, But there's also, there's a little element of we did want to make it a little different this time

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because I think the first time was so special and so unique, so unique, that we wanted to make it more about the fans this time.

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We spent so much time in chairs in a room answering gorgeous questions

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and having beautiful conversations with the most thoughtful journalists and having really beautiful, wonderful moments.

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but we were thinking about it and the fans really changed everything for us

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and we were just kind of like how can we make it more about the fans this time

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and you know we had a discussion about doing a concert

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because I said we didn't sing on the first press tour

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I said Cynthia we didn't sing anything until the Oscars we

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never sang let's sing for them like let's sing for the fans

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so we used our week to put together this special with Chris Scott and with our incredible family,

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our Ozziean family, Stephen Arimus and everyone, to do that for them.

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That's really what we wanted to give most of our effort to.

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And then we're going to be traveling around and doing the premieres.

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Of course, we're going to be doing press.

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But we're doing press.

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We're doing press.

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Honey, honey, this is the press.

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But, yeah, it's different.

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We've been in different places, and we wanted to make it fan-focused as much as possible.

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I also think the first go-round, you're establishing the look and feel in the world of Wicked, which now we've had a year to luxuriate in.

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And so it's just different in the sense

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that you're no longer having to introduce these characters and introduce the world of this film.

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I just wish you could be there for some of these moments, because we mean the things that we say.

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Like, you know that clip where we're speaking to that lovely woman and we're like, you are the light of our day.

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Like, you really turned our, like, we meant that.

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It was really crazy.

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And I wish you had the context of what had happened a few minutes before.

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But she did.

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She changed our lives.

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Like, she changed our whole day.

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It was just so beautiful.

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We mean it.

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We mean what we say.

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I never, well, I don't think anyone ever doubted the sincerity.

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I think people were just enamored by.

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By theater people.

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Yeah.

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Right.

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Which is funny because the culture has been exposed to theater people before.

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I just watched the Lilith Fair documentary last night.

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Have you seen it yet?

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Not yet.

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Highly recommend.

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And one thing that Sarah McLachlan talks about is that with Lilith Fair, people weren't used to earnestness at the time.

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And they were dragged so much in the press when

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that fair first came around and this tour of all of these iconic women on stage together, just doing the thing they loved.

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And we look back on it now and we're like, Oh my god, Erykah Badu, Queen Latifah, Sarah McLachlan, Paula Cole, all these incredible singers on the stage.

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But I think the world had a difficult time with earnestness.

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Why?

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It scares people so much.

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Yeah.

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And I think that's really sad.

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I think the whole cringe, whatever, is just so unfair.

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I don't know, maybe it's because of PTSD or whatever, but I love so much.

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I'm so grateful to feel so much.

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You know, we should be able to be happy

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and it not be like corny or cringe or classified as like something like that.

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Being passionate about something, loving people, being happy about something, being excited about something.

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That's the best.

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Why do you want me to be sitting here numb? Been there. Been there.

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And I'll tell you from the other side.

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No. No, no, no. Do you know what's great medicine for this?

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What?

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Being in the ensemble of a theater production.

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Yes!

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I feel like when you're a townsperson or doing something in the ensemble, Yes.

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Because ensembles unless it's like Evita they tend not to be morose right?

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You know in general if you're an ensemble you're a music man right?

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You're like there to like cheer on the thing

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and I feel like it gives you that sense of community

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and that sense of joy

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and your role is to be part of something where you're just strictly celebratory and smiling and kicking and cheering.

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Everyone should be in an ensemble.

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And yes at least once.

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Once.

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Because yeah it It unlocks something.

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And I feel like to theater people, Cynthia and I didn't seem crazy.

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No. No, that's normal.

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It was familiar.

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That's normal.

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Yeah.

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Again, to what you're getting at, I think it's less about the two of you and more, not to zoom out too much about it, but I think there's just an apathy around people and the idea

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that people salivate in finding moments where people are being genuine and being like, because they have less accessibility to that genuineness,

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when they see it on display, they react to it in such a way

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which has less to do with what they're seeing and more to do with themselves.

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And because we exist in a society in which whenever a certain segment of people feel something, they feel the need to type, type, type.

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I think it's people getting out their own shit.

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Totally.

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Through the vehicle of the Wicked Press Store.

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Right, right, right.

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Sure.

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Yeah, of all places.

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Yeah, I think that's also just the internet culture in general, I guess, you know?

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But I invite all of the people to feel,

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to be earnest and let their feelings out and cry and be a person who can feel.

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It's a really big gift to feel.

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We're lucky we're alive.

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We are lucky we're alive.

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To be frank.

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To be frank.

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You talked about entering into this experience and saying maybe I'm done with music.

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And then in between these two films, we get an album, and then we, more music, and now a tour is coming.

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Was there an instigating moment, or what happened in the process of making this film that allowed you to want to continue to make music?

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I felt like just a genuine spark like of reconnection and inspiration and something.

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I mean, maybe I missed it.

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Maybe it's as simple as I missed it, But I do feel like you have to miss things in order to learn how to become better for them.

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And I think I learned so much.

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And then also, I genuinely wanted to do it.

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It just felt like I couldn't not.

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It was an inspired moment, and I had to write an album.

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And I had to do it.

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And they said, well, you have reshoots in January.

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And I said, great, that's fine.

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I'll finish it before then, or I'll finish it after or I'll get as much as I can done before, finish the reshoots in January or whatever it was.

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No, not the reshoots, the strike, and then we went back to finish the movie.

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Oh, right.

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That's how far away it was.

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We didn't even finish the movie, and I started Eternal Sunshine.

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And then we went back to finish.

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Because I remember when you were going back to finish the movie.

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And getting back in Glinda after all that time away from her.

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And you had to find her once again.

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No, it was there.

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It was there.

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There was nothing to find.

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It was so strange.

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I was like, oh, I wonder if this will feel weird.

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And as soon as I got there, it was like, done.

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She was right there.

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It was wonderful.

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Thank God.

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She was waiting.

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Yeah, she was waiting in the wings.

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But no, yeah, what a crazy timeline.

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I think, yeah, I feel the same way about Eternal Sunshine as I do about doing this mini tour coming up,

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which is like something inside is saying I have to do it.

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And I'm grateful for that, because I don't think I would have said that about a tour forever ago,

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but you know, I'm just being open

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and honest about how I feel about these things in real time and following the impulses creatively, you know?

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They just shout and then there we are, you know?

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Yeah, well, we like that about you.

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Thank you.

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In July, 2024, you stated on this podcast that you planned a quote, mini sampling of shows to support the album.

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I believe there is, as of this recording, 41 dates for the tour.

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Yes.

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Talk to me about how the tour was conceived and how it has grown.

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And might I caveat by saying, thank goodness, to quote the film,

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that it has, people are very eager to get their hands on these tickets.

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I'm very excited, I'm very grateful.

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And also seeing the excitement has been so moving for me too.

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It's been like really emotional to see.

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How did it happen?

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Well, you and I, I mean, we would voice note and say, oh, it is the right thing.

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Oh, it's not the right thing yet.

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It is.

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It's not.

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Not yet.

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I'm working on a version of it that could happen this, you know, this time frame, but that doesn't make sense.

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And, you know, eventually it just seemed like it had to happen.

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I think putting out the deluxe informed me

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that I had to do it

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because I really felt like I'm going to be really sad if I don't sing this album live.

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I love this album and I need to sing it.

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And I think that would be a really special experience for me

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and my fans and also how beautiful to re-imagine my relationship to touring in this baby step way.

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And not that, I mean, this probably won't happen for a long time again after this one, But, but, you know, still, it'll heal something and it'll be really beautiful the same way that this album has.

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I think it'll be a nice next step and I think it'll be so fun to see the fans.

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So that's how it happened and why it happened.

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And I love that it's concise and it's a sampling.

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It's exactly what we discussed.

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It's, I'm very grateful.

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I'm excited.

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Is there a particular song that you're most excited to sing live for your fans?

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Everything that is on the set list.

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I have in my, I've already made it.

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I've already made it.

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Yes.

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But I think it's a really strong set list.

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I'm proud, I'm grateful.

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Can't wait.

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Obviously, I'm a huge fan of Sarah Jessica Parker's.

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Yes.

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I know you're a huge fan of Sarah Jessica Parker's.

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I was getting ready for today and I wanted to have some people call in and ask.

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Oh, is that who it is?

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And ask some questions.

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I'm gonna die!

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That's crazy!

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I want to bring the icon Sarah Jessica Parker into the conversation.

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This is a little long-winded, she will admit, and a little multi-part, but here we go.

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Oh my god.

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Greetings, Ariana.

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It's Sarah Jessica.

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And I have a question.

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Well, I could have a million questions, but I will be disciplined and try to ask just one.

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That's part one.

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That's part one.

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Oh, wait.

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she's so extraordinarily gifted and has at this point and for quite a while achieved an authority

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and you know a kind of control um of her career my a question is

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when she was little and i i'm i think about myself

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and what i imagined for myself when i first thought to myself and i understood and really vague in general terms, oh, I want to be an actor.

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I want to act and I want to sing to the extent I understood what that meant.

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And I think now, oh,

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this is, I couldn't have imagined this or I couldn't have known this.

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And it's not the question that everybody asks me, which I don't like.

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You know, what advice would you give your younger self?

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I'd say I'd give myself no advice.

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Everything that happened, I'm really grateful for because, you know, whether it's been painful or great or triumphant or incredibly disappointing,

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all has been probably good for me, even if I thought at the time it wasn't at the most painful moments.

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But what did she imagine it would be when she said to a parent, a sibling, a co-worker, even at a young age.

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I want to be an actor.

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What did she think and what has she come to understand what it means and how has that, how radically different is it?

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Is that too complicated and weird?

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Let me know and if not, I can ask her about books.

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No, I really have a second thing.

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You tell me.

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But you can make it better.

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I love her so much.

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There's something about, I mean, obviously you and are big voice memoirs, when I look down on my phone and I see a long one from her,

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and it takes a while sometimes to get to the meat of the thought, and she'll be like, I'm sorry it's so long-winded, and I'm like, I'll go with you wherever.

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Yeah.

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Keep going.

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Oh my goodness, I love her so much.

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What a thoughtful and gentle and caring question.

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I love her so, sorry, that just totally shocked me.

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I can't believe she knows who I am shocked me.

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Not that she knows who you are.

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No, yes.

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But yeah, it's, yeah, what a beautiful question.

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I mean, I guess I would say it's almost entirely different from what I thought it was going to be, you know, as a child.

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I am sure she feels similarly, but, you know, I was so focused on just art

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and singing and laughter and comedy and performing and acting and all I really ever want.

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I'm a theater kid.

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I'm a nerd.

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I'm a writer.

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I like to make people laugh.

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I love to disappear into characters.

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And that's always been the thing that excites me the most.

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There is a whole different beast.

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There's a whole different thing that comes with this and

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that I was sort of thrust into more so when my pop career sort of happened.

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The fame element is so peculiar and hard to navigate, especially as a person who, yeah, I feel everything.

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And I think that's my gift and sometimes my curse. But it's really weird.

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I don't think I was prepared for that part.

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You know, I just, I love performing.

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And I always wanted to do it.

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I spent every single minute of my free time as a kid doing community theater,

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family theater, playing parts in different shows or writing songs in my room, learning how to use different musical gadgets and whatever.

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It was just, you know, I never thought about the part where like you're in a magazine or like you're on a red carpet,

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which, you know, I love fashion.

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It's become very lovely and I love fashion.

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It's fun.

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And then, you know, promoting projects you really care about has actually become really fun for me.

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But that's taken me a long time, a long time to get there.

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Like, I think probably the first 10 years out, I really struggled with what comes with it.

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And, yeah, I'm really proud of kind of the work that I have done to reclaim my relationship to

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my art and sort of put that piece of it in a box.

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So I don't think I was expecting the success piece to feel so complicated, I guess.

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But I'm proud to be able to kind of put that in a box and still create.

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That took a lot of work and takes a lot of work.

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My work is not done.

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And, you know, we talk about it often, but it takes a lot of like spiritual discernment,

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you know, and like to kind of keep myself afloat and prioritize the things that matter.

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And, you know, I mentioned success or whatever, but success is happiness in the relationships that you create through art.

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You know, I know that both exist, but that it's it's interesting.

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I wasn't expecting that, the kind of, the negative parts of it.

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As a kid, I never considered that.

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I just knew I wanted to share what I thought was my gift, you know, and perform.

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So that is, it's very different than what I had imagined.

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But I'm proud of the ways

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that I have been able to take the little girl's hand

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who didn't know what was waiting on the other side and kind of like say, no, we're not gonna like give up on this thing we love.

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We're gonna figure out how to do it and be healthy.

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And we're still figuring it out.

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But you know, I guess, is that what she asked?

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Yes, and I love that answer.

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Okay.

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I love that answer.

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Okay.

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Can I add to that too?

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It's like you are someone who, and I love and admire this so much about you.

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I don't think it's so binary as there are people like this and there are people that aren't.

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but you are an artist who likes the process of making the art.

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Keep going.

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No, it's okay, I'm gonna try the other side.

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This one's soggy.

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Do you think that would be better?

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You think that would be better on the flip side?

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Oh yeah, because this side can't get in anymore.

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Oh, it's like a mushy egg.

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It's soggy.

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It's done.

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It has a hard out.

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No, please.

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The straw has a hard out at whatever it is.

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You like the process of creation.

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You like being in the studio.

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You like being in the rehearsal room.

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You like noodling over this project with John and Cynthia you like that aspect of it.

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And when I say it's not binary, it doesn't mean those who don't are not good artists or that is the correct way to be an artist.

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But I think one thing about you, and I think this has been true of you for a long time, is how much, how process-oriented you are.

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And so, whatever the outcome may be.

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I love the process.

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Love the process.

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I love the process.

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You gotta love the process.

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I love the process of every kind of creating.

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I live for it.

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And I think it can make, when you have that love of the process, I think it can make the outcome hold less weight, right?

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Because regardless of the outcome, you own the process.

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You have the process.

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How something is received or how people react to it, all of that, that's completely out of your hands in so many instances, but you get to own the process.

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No one can take the process from you.

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And when you love the process, it means that there's this part of creation

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that you will consistently get to have and you get to own and it's yours.

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And you love process.

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I do love process.

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I listened to a recent interview with Hayley Williams and she talked about how coming up in this business, she didn't have a lot of mentors.

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And I'm wondering what your relationship with mentorship in both music and film has been.

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Well, I'm very lucky that my idols have been very kind to me.

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I remember Madonna immediately was very kind and it was like,

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I think she was one of the first people to reach out and give me a warm welcome,

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and it was just really cool.

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And I was overwhelmed by it because I love her so much,

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and I felt kind of so grateful to have that welcome from her, and then of course, Mariah,

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and then Beyonce had me come visit a music video she was shooting, and I was just there in the corner.

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I was like, why am I here?

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And she was just, it was after I sang Tattooed Heart on the AMAs, I believe it was, and she invited me to visit her,

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and she just was being kind, and she just gave me a little bit of advice, and I asked, and she was so kind.

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And yeah, and even if I'm not super close, it was just a really kind thing for her to do that.

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But yeah, I feel like I had people that I really looked up to embrace me in a really kind way, and it made me feel safe.

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What about becoming artistic equals with some of these people?

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I mean, you mentioned Mariah.

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Not equals.

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Okay, well, I can say equals.

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You don't have to say it.

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I'll say equals.

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But like you mentioned Mariah, Barbara Streisand, another one, for instance.

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She was so kind to me, too.

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But it'd be one thing for her to reach out and be like, so kind.

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But she's not just being so kind and she's also saying, I see in you such talent that I want to go talent to talent with you,

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jump on a track together.

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I can imagine that that's overwhelming, but when you're in the room actually getting to, we talked earlier, you love process,

473

you love making art, you're in these instances getting to make art with artists who you admire, you're in the groove with them.

474

It's not just, I love you, you're so great, blah, blah, blah, which that's fun and that's meaningful too, but it's actually getting to create together.

475

What have those moments been like?

476

I guess I feel shy to talk about it

477

because it's like I'm choked up hearing you remind me that that is my reality and it's just very meaningful.

478

It's very, I cherish it, I'm very grateful and it's just really cool.

479

I remember the first time I worked with Mariah when we got to set, she was like, oh, I love that harmony you did on this

480

and I added a harmony beneath it because I loved it and I was like, I'm gonna, I'm dead.

481

You know?

482

It's just very surreal and special.

483

And yeah, I feel so grateful again.

484

It's just, I love the work that I'm able to do,

485

and then to have your idols kind of embrace and encourage is really wild.

486

Is there anyone on that list, and I'm sure it changes over time, but when I say someone that you'd love to collaborate with in the future,

487

Is there someone that comes to mind?

488

No can be an answer.

489

I don't know, because it depends on the project.

490

It depends on the sound.

491

It depends on the, you know.

492

But I mean, of course, Imogen Heap is my number one favorite artist of all time.

493

She's my number one.

494

She's the reason I produce.

495

She's the reason I, like, know how to work anything.

496

And, you know, downloaded softwares to learn how to produce music and record myself.

497

And I love her.

498

Yeah, that moment would be really beautiful someday.

499

But I support her in everything that she does.

500

She's incredible.

501

She has her Mimu gloves and they're incredible.

502

Have you ever seen them?

503

No. They're amazing.

504

Do I need them?

505

Yeah, I would love to know what you would do with them.

506

Wow.

507

That would be really fun.

508

Well, you can technically program them to do anything.

509

You can program them to do the lights in your house if you want.

510

But they're gloves that are like a MIDI keyboard.

511

So you can assign different things to different postures.

512

Like, if you want the point to be like, you're turning a harmonizer on or off.

513

It's like does that, you assign different postures to different things, like if you want to pitch, grab a note, so you'd be like,

514

and then you could grab it and it would continue the note if you're not singing, and you can speed it up and it'll be like,

515

or like you can pan it left and right in the arena and like pan the sound or like add a harmonizer.

516

And it's bizarre, but she's, but she invented this technology, the Mimu gloves and like forever ago and they're so amazing.

517

Like she's just a genius.

518

I mentioned Hayley Williams.

519

Yes.

520

She wanted to call in and ask you a question.

521

Oh, my God.

522

That's so cool.

523

I'm screaming.

524

I love her.

525

She's incredible.

526

Her voice is unbelievable.

527

Oh, my God.

528

And the purity.

529

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

530

Hi, Ariana.

531

It's Hayley.

532

I need to get out of the way really quickly that I loved Eternal Sunshine and Supernatural was my favorite song.

533

I listened to it on repeat in the car all the time when that record dropped.

534

I just think you're a cool artist.

535

I've really enjoyed watching you grow and change.

536

I mean, you've untangled yourself from the Disney machine.

537

You've proven yourself through your albums.

538

And then you took a huge leap with Wicked.

539

And from everything that I read about it, you really worked hard for that.

540

That was like a goal that you set.

541

And that just made it really fun to watch you achieve it.

542

And your comedic timing is great.

543

I hope you do so many more movies and I don't know, maybe you need to be in a Broadway show.

544

I'm not sure.

545

Whatever you want, you could do it.

546

But I want to hear from you, what have each of those transitions felt like?

547

What does it feel like for you when you're scared of the next step or when you really,

548

really want to achieve something for yourself or challenge yourself to something?

549

What are the voices in your head?

550

Do you struggle with self-doubt?

551

Do you like feel in your gut like you got it

552

and you just got to get through the wobbly beginning of learning something new?

553

I want to say when I saw you in Wicked, I had this thought and obviously outsider's perspective.

554

So this is just from my vantage point.

555

I thought, man, Ariana Grande is like really found herself.

556

This feels like she is with her people.

557

she is doing the thing that she's meant to do

558

and it's so connected to music still

559

but it's like we kind of get a whole new side of you through it

560

and um yeah I guess I I'm just I'm in my

561

own transition transitional moment in my career trying to challenge myself

562

and and grow in new ways as an artist

563

and just as a person

564

so yeah I'd love to hear you talk about what are

565

what are some more your goals what are the challenges

566

that you face that are internal what are the struggles you face

567

that feel more like external and industry and all of

568

that like where do you wanna go from here

569

because you could really do anything i mean you have a fan base

570

that is gonna be there

571

but also like i think as someone who is not maybe

572

not technically your peer i'm not really a pop artist

573

but someone that's been in this a long time like you have i'm just really impressed

574

and i can't wait to see what you do next

575

and i want to know how your headspace is probably not like a great super clear question

576

but hopefully it starts the conversation um hope you guys have

577

a great convo evan thanks for asking me to do this

578

and um ariana maybe i'll see you out there in the

579

world somewhere i would love to see her out there in

580

the world somewhere what a beautiful i these this This is too much.

581

I'm so emotional.

582

Oh my God, that was so kind and generous and beautiful.

583

I'm so moved by this question.

584

What the hell?

585

Oh my God.

586

First of all, I love her so much.

587

I love her so much.

588

Second of all, what the hell did she ask?

589

I know.

590

I'm so sorry.

591

I got lost in her voice.

592

Monster, you know, about the struggles and the monsters and the scary voice and the thing, yeah, of course.

593

I think I'm really attracted to things that scare me a little bit.

594

Like I said, the idea of doing a tour that terrified me.

595

And also the idea of chasing Wicked was also terrifying to me because I wanted it so much.

596

But I really wanted to work to earn it.

597

I love projects that scare the living hell out of me.

598

You know, I was terrified to put my album out every time.

599

But most recently, the original Eternal Sunshine and the Deluxe, I hid with my best friends and I said, is this it?

600

Is this the end?

601

I'm going inside and like, I can never do this again.

602

And you know, that feeling is just like, it's beautiful

603

because it means you're making something that is just your heart is on your sleeve

604

and you're vulnerable and you're going to grow from it

605

and um someone somewhere will connect with it you know

606

but I want to go back to the part

607

because she asked about the monsters in my head right yeah

608

those yeah I try to learn from them that's something

609

that I've spent a lot of time unpacking with my acting coach Nancy

610

because they're really informative when you pay attention to your monsters and your fears and the voices who tell you,

611

you know, that you can't or that it's not good enough or that it's not going to be right for whatever reason.

612

There's always something to learn from those guys.

613

But when it comes to showing up on set on a day

614

when you have to get the work done

615

and you need them to leave you alone or when it comes time to walk into the audition,

616

you have to kind of ask them to leave

617

and I think I've I've reached a place with my monsters where I appreciate them

618

because I know

619

that they're trying to protect me from disappointment from more hurt from more whatever you know

620

but they're not productive for me as an artist

621

so I lovingly ask them I have a name for them

622

and I and I lovingly ask them if they can just get me a coffee and come back in 15.

623

And they do.

624

I think that's like a big part of trauma work actually is like befriending those monsters

625

and learning that like little things that you've developed along the way, little, you know, since I was a little girl, I had OCD, like all,

626

you know, things, are trying to protect you.

627

And that lens is really helpful when it comes to those negative voices because they're more likely to leave the room

628

if you're asking them with kindness and appreciation for what they're doing for you, which is protecting you.

629

So that is my answer to that.

630

And then the last part was something about where are you going from here.

631

I think I see I always want to be creating.

632

I always want to be creative.

633

But I think it's going to look very different moving forward.

634

I'd like to be on stage.

635

I want to do theater.

636

I want to spend more time acting than I did the last, you know, 12 years of my career.

637

I think that balance will be important for me because I have learned how much having both feels very,

638

feels good for my soul.

639

I don't know, I have no idea.

640

You don't need to know.

641

I don't know what I've said.

642

But you don't need to know.

643

That was such a beautiful, long question and I feel like I didn't answer.

644

You did, and you answered it thoughtfully.

645

And what I love about that question coming from her is that I can't ask you that question

646

because her proximity to the artistry and to the kind of life that only figures like you both get to lead,

647

there's an intimacy.

648

I mean, like I said to her, I was like, it's just, I value her asking that question because it wouldn't be the same coming from me.

649

Well, I also feel that you know my answer as well.

650

But I like hearing you talk about the monsters.

651

I know.

652

I know, I think it's important to talk about our monsters.

653

I agree.

654

We talked about musicians that you want to work with, some that I would like you to work with.

655

There's an actor that wants to work with you, and I wanted to bring her into the conversation as our last guest.

656

Hey, Ari.

657

It's Coolidge.

658

How are you?

659

Yeah, I had a question for you.

660

I was wondering if you would like to do like a...

661

I know what she's going to say.

662

Would you like to do a buddy movie where you and I We're on the run,

663

we're on the lam and we're in deep trouble and we have to do a lot of running.

664

Just curious if you'd be interested in that.

665

I would love that.

666

All right, call me sometime, bye.

667

I would absolutely love that.

668

How can we get that in motion?

669

I fully want to see that.

670

I would love that.

671

Yes, call me too.

672

Great.

673

I love her so much.

674

I knew it was gonna be that.

675

I knew you knew it was gonna be, cause last time I had you on we called her live.

676

And it went off the rails.

677

I love it.

678

And then so she sent that to me, she said that she'd mentioned it to you before, and she was like, I don't know if it comes off as desperate for me to ask, and I said, well it doesn't, I said closed mouths don't get fed.

679

But I also said by us putting it into the ether, by her mentioning it, by you responding to it,

680

it instigates perhaps someone out there to get some ball into motion.

681

Because, you know, we say in jest, like, oh, wouldn't it be funny if the two of you were in like an action buddy cop whatever together?

682

I would love that.

683

But in actuality, like, I see box office gold there.

684

So I hope that by mentioning it today, we can perhaps will it into being.

685

I think that's important.

686

Couple last topics.

687

I just want to ask about fashion.

688

You began working with law once again.

689

Yes.

690

And we've seen quite a bit from this press tour

691

but I want to talk about what led you back to Law and what collaborating with him gives you, not just the looks, obviously we see the looks,

692

but I get the sense from knowing you both

693

that this collaboration is more meaningful than just someone that shows you some clothes and says, wear this.

694

Absolutely.

695

I mean, I love Law so much.

696

We worked together for a really long time when we were young and sort of experiencing experiencing such,

697

so many firsts, you know, together, or I feel like I was experiencing so many firsts with, with law in my life.

698

And, you know, I, I missed him so much.

699

I, it's, I feel like we speak the same language.

700

And as a friend, and as an artist, I respect him so much and it just feels like coming home.

701

Not only are the clothes, of course, such a treat, but just the company.

702

We laugh.

703

My mom comes sometimes.

704

We, like, order room service.

705

We hang out.

706

And, yeah, it's beautiful.

707

It feels like family, you know?

708

He was close with my grandparents.

709

Like, he knows my family.

710

And, yeah, it feels like a beautiful homecoming for us.

711

I mean, I know we are so excited to see you two back together.

712

he has become a you know his role on Drag Race has expanded oh yes

713

and I say to him all the time you know he's now doing this project runway thing

714

and we get to see him more on Drag Race

715

and I'm just like I predict almost everything he's gonna say on

716

that show by the way amazing that this man makes yes

717

and so on the subject of Drag Race obviously people know

718

that you are a super fan of the show it's often a thing

719

that you and I go back and forth about yeah

720

if I were to task you

721

and I thought about this last night I was like I don't even know how I would answer it, but.

722

Oh God.

723

A Mount Rushmore of Drag Race, is that something you can do?

724

And it's hard just because you can only choose four and there are so many viable, and it always feels like you're leaving someone out.

725

Evie Oddly.

726

Okay.

727

Is the first that comes to mind.

728

This is so hard.

729

Yeah, by you not selecting them, it doesn't mean that they are inept.

730

No!

731

They're royalty.

732

They're royalty.

733

Forever on Mount Rushmore.

734

My personal.

735

You're a personal on Mount Rushmore.

736

Yeah.

737

I think Evie, Jinx, Oh My God.

738

This is the hardest question I've ever been asked ever.

739

Not just today.

740

Because Gottmik has to be there but also so does Simone and so does Violet.

741

And so does Willow.

742

And so does I Can't Do This.

743

So we'll expand and it's a mountain

744

so I feel like we can just there's more we can chip away at more of the mountain.

745

I love all of the girls.

746

They know.

747

They know.

748

And they love you.

749

So, Fokker & Law is coming out almost a year exactly to the day.

750

There were obviously a lot of offers that came your way.

751

What was it about this project for you that made you say this is the correct follow-up?

752

I dive into a script.

753

As soon as I receive something, I read it and I read it down.

754

And I feel like I can always search for a reason why it doesn't make sense

755

or like find something that doesn't work and there will always be things

756

that you know will have to be found

757

or like evolve for the character

758

when you get to know the character more blah blah blah

759

and whatever but it was the first thing that I read

760

that I was just kind of like I have to do it like I love it

761

and I also love obviously I love Ben

762

and I love Mr. De Niro

763

so much I love Owen Wilson I love everyone I love the whole Fokker's verse very much.

764

Barbara, of course, everyone.

765

Blythe.

766

But you know, when it comes to a franchise like that, it's so daunting to receive the fourth Fokker's script.

767

I know it's a wonderful big comedy, but it also has a really nice message,

768

I think, and it's also so special that Ben is now the age that De Niro was in the first movie.

769

So there's that generational trauma a piece of like, you know, projecting what happened to you onto your son, who is the new girlfriend, and is she or isn't she?

770

And I love her.

771

I love Olivia.

772

She's very fun and very different.

773

And yeah, we're having a really good time.

774

And it's evident, I mean, not just from my conversations with you, but just there seems to be a joy emanating from this set.

775

Yeah.

776

And I also think we're just eager to see the next stage of these characters' evolution.

777

I mean, we watched Greg and crew from the very beginning.

778

I love Greg.

779

Love Greg.

780

And I love you saying Mr. De Niro.

781

Mr. De Niro.

782

I mean, it's so fun to see how they evolve.

783

John Hamburg, our director, and he wrote it, it's just, it's so funny.

784

And I'm so excited for people to see it because I don't think that they could possibly predict what is coming.

785

But I really love Greg.

786

I love working with Ben.

787

And I'm such a fan of his.

788

I was so out of body the first few days.

789

I was like, this is very surreal because it was very one-on-one.

790

We have a lot of one-on-one stuff.

791

And it's just a dream.

792

I mean, he's so incredible.

793

And I love ad-libbing with him and finding this weird relationship that we have.

794

And Olivia's a little weird.

795

Like, she's kind of weird.

796

You'll see.

797

But, yeah, I'm really enjoying it.

798

And I love everyone.

799

And it's really fun.

800

Thank you so much for tuning in to part one.

801

Please come back and join us for part two very soon where we will get into all things Wicked, including spoilers.

What is the Shadowing Technique?

Shadowing is a science-backed language learning technique originally developed for professional interpreter training and popularized by polyglot Dr. Alexander Arguelles. The method is simple but powerful: you listen to native English audio and immediately repeat it out loud — like a shadow following the speaker with just a 1–2 second delay. Unlike passive listening or grammar drills, shadowing forces your brain and mouth muscles to simultaneously process and reproduce real speech patterns. Research shows it significantly improves pronunciation accuracy, intonation, rhythm, connected speech, listening comprehension, and speaking fluency — making it one of the most effective methods for IELTS Speaking preparation and real-world English communication.

Shadowing Practice: Ariana Grande Part 1 (Full Episode) | Shut Up Evan Podcast - Learn English Speaking with Video

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What is the Shadowing Technique?