Prática de Shadowing: Alibaba's Ma Reflects On 12-Year Journey at China 2.0 Conference - Aprenda a falar inglês com vídeo

It's a great pleasure for us to give a warm welcome to Jack Ma.

Thank you.

Hi.

It's my great honor, and I was invited about months ago, and And I did not expect this,

people said this is a very sensitive time for me to talk because about Yahoo, about Alibaba, about this and that.

But the promise is a promise, I come.

Today, any questions you have?

I will answer every question you have.

All right, so I've been here for 15 days and I plan to spend one year here.

And nobody knows, my company did not know that I'm gonna spend a year here.

I guess people ask why you're here.

Are you ready for getting Yahoo?

No. Everybody was very sensitive when I said I'm going to spend one year there.

And I just come here, I'm tired.

Too tired in the past 16 years.

I started my business when I started 1994, found internet.

And I got crazy about the internet and give up my job in the teaching.

I call myself like a blind man riding on the back of blind tigers, jumping around, still kicking and still surviving.

And then joined the government organization for 16 months and not successful, start Alibaba 1999.

And we built up the Alibaba, we're lucky enough to have the Taobao, we have the Alipay, we have Aliclock computing and so many things.

So after 12 years, I say, I need some time to rest.

Especially this year was so difficult for me.

I did not expect, I prepared for 12 years in China called .

This is our 12 year for Alibaba.

At the beginning of the year, we have the moving for the Alibaba B2B CEO because of the customer cheating things.

And then we have the Alipay and about the VIE, I still don't know what the VIE is, right?

And then we have the Alipay separated in four parts.

So many things that really make me feel tired.

And I said, well, why not give up one year?

Because next year is my personal Benminian.

Which is, could be much more difficult.

So this year was very tough and difficult.

I believe next year is gonna be tougher and more difficult and more complex.

So I got ready for that.

And I think I need a rest, so in order to for another three, four years hard working, because these three years is not my job.

If something wrong, criticize this president of Taobao, CEO of Alibaba, and Alipay is their fault, because three years, their fault.

So, three years later, something wrong, my fault.

So, I come here and I will spend most of time in the States and then thinking, relaxing, and just two days ago,

I pick up my golf here and just relax.

So nothing about the things people think about.

So, we are a very lucky company.

And there's no chance that we survive.

I don't have any sort of backgrounds, a rich father or strong uncles, so.

And I remember 1999, I came to Silicon Valley looking for venture capitalists.

I talked to a lot of venture capitalists and I remember a few days when I drive by the Manlo Park, right?

I was rejected by so many venture capitalists.

When I talk about Alibaba's startups, they look at me strange.

What?

Alibaba, what are they talking about?

But I went back to China with nothing, no money, nobody invested in me.

But I'm full of confidence.

I saw the American dreams.

At that time, 1999, I walk on the high express,

the high express every evening full of cars and in the parks of the companies, every Sunday weekend full of cars.

And people working day and night.

And now this is something I believe is going to happen in China.

Without getting any venture capitalist, but I think I went back to China with the American dreams.

And we started the business there and after 12 years, a lot of things happened.

We would build up the B2B and nobody believed the B2B would work

because the B2B at that time was good by Ariba.

I don't know, still there?

Yeah, Ariba.

Ariba .com, Broadvision and Commerce One, and these are very famous B2B companies.

People say, how can you do B2B in China?

China, because B2B in the USA, they focus on big companies.

They focus on buyers.

And we believe there's no big companies in China.

And I don't see there are big companies in the short term that China will have a lot of big companies, because big companies only SOE.

SOE, they do not need e -commerce.

They need is government policy, right?

So, we focus a small business business.

We believe China, the small business, the private sectors are the future.

So we focus on that.

And the B2B in the US, they focus on buyers.

They want help the buyers to save the cost, to save the time.

We believe, don't teach the SME, don't teach the small business how to save the cost, because they know much better than you do.

You should help them how to make money.

So we focus on helping small business, we focus on helping them to make money to sell things abroad.

Very difficult to do business at that time,

but after 12 years, we got more than 58 million small business around the world using our services.

That model is not very sexy compared to Tencent, Baidu, we did not make that much money like online gaming.

But we can sleep well in the evening because the money we make, not online gaming.

The money we make, they're helping small business to survive, to get business opportunities, which I feel very proud of that.

And today, as always, I never feel proud of how much money we make.

I feel proud how much impact we can help the others, especially small business.

Before the history of internet, no company can help over 50 million SMEs.

Today, we are trying.

And I feel proud of that.

This is the first company, and people say, Jack, if you make Alibaba successful,

that means you are pulling a million tons of sheep on the top of the Himalaya.

And I say, yes, we will carry that thing down.

And we did.

The second company is called the Taobao.

And everybody say, my god, you're competing with eBay.

I say, why not?

China needs an e -commerce site.

And build up the China market takes efforts, takes time.

And takes great effort, you really want to build up something.

So at that time people say there's no chance.

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Well, if you never try, how do you know there's no chance?

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So we tried, and I said, if eBay are the sharks in the ocean, we are the crocodiles in the Yanzhou River.

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Never fight in the ocean, let's fight the Yanzhou River.

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It was difficult, it's a lot of fun, and we survived.

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They got a 90 % market share at that time.

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Today, for C2C, we're like 90 % market share.

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And lucky, just lucky.

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There are a lot of things can be discussed in the future.

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Today, people always write about the successful stories about Alibaba.

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And I really don't think we're so smart.

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We made so many mistakes.

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We were so stupid at that time.

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So I think someday the book I personally really want to write about, as I said, is Alibaba 1001 Mistakes.

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These are the things people should remember, people should learn.

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If you want to learn how the other people succeed, it's very difficult.

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There are a lot of lucky things right there.

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But if you want to learn, if you learn how people feel, you will benefit a lot.

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And I always like to read those books talking about how people feel.

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Because look, if you look into it, any company that feel, the reasons why they feel almost the same.

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And that really matters.

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So, Taobao succeed and then we have the Alipay because everybody say China, no credit system, banking is terrible, logistics terrible, and how can you do e -commerce?

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I never tell, just like today, I come here without a PPT, without my business, I'm not coming here to sell your business.

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Sell my business because I don't have stocks to sell to you guys.

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But I think because China is not good at logistics, not good at credit system, not good at banking system,

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that's why we need the entrepreneurship.

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That's why we should go and build them up.

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So I believe if there's no, you beat it up.

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Later, this becomes the standard of China.

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And I believe China needs that.

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I remember six years ago, I came to the States, I told the USA audience, I say, I believe five years later, China will have more internet users than the USA.

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People say, no. I say, well, you have only 300 million population.

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China 1 .3 billion, right?

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For you guys to have 400 million internet users without anybody dying, keep on having babies, you take 50 years.

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We need five years.

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It's just the time issues, right?

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So let's wait and see.

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Today, we have more users.

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And today people say, wow, your buying capability is low.

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Let's see about five years later.

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Five years later, today people only spend 200 RMB per month.

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Five years later, these guys will spend 2 ,000.

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And we have patience, we are young.

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I'm old, but my people only 26 average age.

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They're young, let's wait for the future.

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So Alipay was just a very, that time people say it's a stupid escrow services, right?

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John wants to buy things from Steven, John does not want to buy the money and Steve does not want to give the product.

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So we open an account to say, buy the money to us.

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If you're happy, we buy the money.

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Not happy, return products, return the money.

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People say, how stupid the model is.

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Well, we don't care whether stupid or not stupid.

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We care whether customer want it or not.

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Whether really meet the needs of the customers.

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It is stupid, but after seven years, we have more than 600 million users, registered users in China using that.

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So, stupid things, if you improve it every day, it's going to be very smart.

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And we believe that.

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So today it is good, and it's growing, and it's like PayPal,

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but we are bigger than PayPal right now, transaction wise.

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And the last and most important is Ali Cloud computing.

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And not like the other companies, they talk about Ali, they talk about cloud computing, they want to sell you the hardware,

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softwares, we have nothing to sell you.

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We just want computing our own data.

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Because of the data we have from the SMEs, because the data we have the consumers data from Taobao, data from Ali Payne.

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So we believe in the future, the world is going to be the data processing world.

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How we can share the data with the others in a great way, right?

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So that's the thing, that's the business about.

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It's not that good yet, but it is very profitable.

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The whole company looks healthy, so we are very appreciate.

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We are the company full of things.

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There's no chance we can win.

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Now, we survive.

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I think we always ask our own question, why we still working so hard?

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I talked to my colleague one day and he said, Jack, I never know that in my life I can do that much.

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Second, I never know that the things I'm doing are that meaningful to the society.

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And third, I never know that life is that hard.

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We work day and night, even now.

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We work day and night.

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I get so thinner and strange and - I understand life is not easy.

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We feel proud because we are changing China.

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It's not how much money you make.

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When you see, I think, ten years ago, when I walk on the street,

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people thank me because my Alibaba B2B helped them to get orders across the ocean.

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Today, when I walk on the street, the young people say, Jack, thank you very much.

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My wife and I opened a small shop on Taobao.

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We made a surviving, we had a great income, and this is meaningful thing.

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We make the credit means money.

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Years ago, if you have a great record of credit, trust, but you're not rich.

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Today, if you have a good record on Taobao, you get rich.

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Because people do business with those people with good record.

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We're teaching consumers to smart.

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People say, Jack, I bought something so cheap on Taobao.

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Is that a fake product?

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Yes, we do.

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Fake products are everywhere, but we spend most of the efforts in China.

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50 % of the people in Taobao, they're focusing on checking the intellectual property issues.

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But there's a bottle of wine, the cost is only $9.

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The people buy on the street is $300.

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Why is that?

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The channels, the advertisement, the TV shows.

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Why consumers should pay that much?

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So we cut that.

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And we make things changing, so tell the consumers, say, this T -shirt you buy on top of maybe $15.

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You buy in a shop $150, not because top of selling cheaper, because that shop sell too expensive.

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We should teach the consumers to be smart.

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And the third very important, we saw so many factories in China, especially in Canton, they're not a company.

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They're not even a factory.

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They just OEM, they just sell things, they just a manufacturer.

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They don't know who are selling for them, and they don't know who are the customers.

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So anything come, they're all in trouble.

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So we should tell the manufacturers, You have to contact the consumers yourself.

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You have to sell yourself, serve yourself, then this is a real business.

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Otherwise, it's just a workshop. And we're changing that.

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And I feel proud, and we are honored.

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It's not about money, as we believe.

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When you have one million IMB or one million US dollars, you're a rich man.

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When you have 10 million US dollars, you're in trouble.

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You worry about inflation, IMB, and you start to invest, you get into trouble.

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When you have one billion, that's not your money.

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It's the society's trust.

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The shareholder, the people believe you can spend this money smarter than the government.

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You can spend the money than the others.

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So they give you the trust.

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How can you do this trust?

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How can you treat this trust well?

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And I think we are facing this challenge.

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And the product for Alibaba is not the people, it's not the service, It's the people, the employees, the colleagues.

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The average age of the company is 26 years old.

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And we are facing so many challenges, guys.

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I never realized that one of the key government officers of another country visited me and said,

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Jack, my God, you have 300 million users on Taobao, and the population is much bigger than my country.

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I said, yeah, it is difficult.

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Any policy we're making, we get in a big trouble.

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Because people say, this is pretty good.

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Some people complain, it's just like a government policy making.

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And those people who are making policies, they're average age 26.

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We have never met this kind of things.

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If we change, like search engine.

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The normal search engine, who pays better, who leaks on the top?

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We believe we should put the trust record, the credit record on that.

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And then we put that, a lot of people say we will demonstrate.

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200 people last year came to our company, demonstrate, say, Jack, you changed the policy,

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you got to pay, but I say, if it is right, let's do it.

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And this is the world we're changing.

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And now today what we need is not pure programs, not service people, a product manager, what we need is sociologists,

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economists, and those guys who make the principle and the policies.

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So we are facing a lot of challenges, but we feel proud because I believe in In the 21st century,

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if you want to be a successful company, you have to learn how to solve a problem of the society,

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instead of catching one or two opportunities.

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It is so easy to catch opportunities.

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And I'm not bragging, I think today, after 12 years jumping around, I find that making money is very simple.

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But making sustainable money and responsible to the society, improve the world.

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Meanwhile, making a lot of money is very difficult.

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And this is what we are trying.

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And we think China, because of internet, is improving.

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And three years later, I'm preparing for that.

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Today, people say, China's stock, internet stock going down, that because of the VIE,

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because of what, and this.

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No, I think, look at the US economy.

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This is, they're facing big challenges.

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Europe probably go nowhere, right?

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China, anything that happens today in the US and Europe is going to happen in China three years later.

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China is going to face a big challenge three, four years later.

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And if you know something bad is coming, get ready for it, instead of screaming now, instead of complaining.

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And as internet companies, we have to take responsibility.

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And my job, I'm not politician, I'm not speak for government, I'm speak for myself, for our own business, speak for my customers.

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50 million SMEs and 8 million top of power sellers, how they should survive three years later.

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This is something I want to come here in the States, learn how Obama say I'm going to create jobs.

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How he did that.

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Any mistake, we should learn from it, and three years later, let's solve it in our way.

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This is why I'm here.

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So I think you all have a lot of questions.

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Am I ready to answer any questions you have?

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Because I don't know what to talk about later, because I'm just here, it's just a free talk, right?

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Thank you very much, any questions you have.

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Take the other side, thanks.

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Well, Mr. Ma, you brought it up first, so I'm gonna make you answer your own questions and be honest about it.

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Are you going to buy Yahoo?

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Good question.

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Yes, we are very interested in that.

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We are very interested in Yahoo because our asset, Alibaba Group is so important to Yahoo.

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And Yahoo assets also very, very important to us, to the internet users and to the industries.

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So, yeah, we are interested in and also all the P, and all the serious buyers,

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they already talked to us and they should talk to us more.

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Have you made the initial approach to them about buying them?

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I'm just to show you that we are very interested in right now.

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Thank you.

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Hey, Jack.

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Actually, I'm not going to ask that tough question.

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I was actually encouraged by Joe this morning and he said that anything about the SENA mode and I

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VIE mode and just ask Jack and he'll be the right person to answer all these questions and Okay,

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seriously, this is a question that I know that PRC government has adopted the

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national security review system against the M &A merged and acquired the PRC company by the foreign companies.

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So my question is how do you view the impact of the scrutiny by the PRC government and And specifically,

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do you think that's going to adversely impact for the PRC company go offshore IPO like get finance from rubber art?

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Okay, yeah.

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So that's my question.

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Probably, I'm sorry for those, I will answer this question in Chinese, which probably more specific.

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Any English translation probably people can help.

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Cuz so many people talk about a VI.

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I've got confused, so I spend a lot of time these days understand what the hell is that.

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Okay, English, right?

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I just be fair, English.

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First, VIE is a great innovation.

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And I believe it's a great innovation.

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Ten years ago, seen a model, it's great.

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It helped China grow on the internet.

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all the other high tech industries which we Alibaba also benefit a lot.

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And I don't see the government is going to take that thing down.

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I never feel that.

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And I don't know why people worry so much about that.

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But some sensitive areas, some industry,

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some sectors like finance, like I don't know what else.

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These things, the government have concerns about VIE structure, which I understand that we should support.

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For example, if anybody want to get a bank, banking license in China like a 20, 25 % foreign capital owned.

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If you want to cross that, any nation will against it.

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So, VIE structure, I did not see any government say, Well, I'm going to shut that thing down.

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What to worry about?

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We should put this thing on the few days ago.

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I read an article about the .

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So the改革 is very good.

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But the改革 is no one of the three -year -old three -year -old government's own.

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The people who live in the world are still in pain.

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It's not in the brain, it's in the brain.

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We got make this VIE really legal, transparent.

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This is the power of internet, making sure if it is good after 10 years testing, it is good, why not open?

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If any tiny sensitive area, if you're not comfortable, join us, discuss about that.

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So I don't know, people say, well, something wrong with the Alipay.

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I'm honored, right?

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Because of that we open VIE, because tell the truth.

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When government, the PBOC, , do Alipay has foreign capital?

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I have to tell the truth, guys. Do you agree?

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If the government say, do you have foreign capital?

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I say, no, but I have.

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This won't work because we are getting bigger, right?

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Just like today if I come to say I want to buy the PayPal, do you think the US does not have any proof?

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No, they will, even if Yahoo, right?

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So we have to be fair.

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It's not that big issue, it's gesture.

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It's gesture, let's face it, open it disgusted it and I don't see the government is going to shut that down.

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All right, I hope I answered your question.

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Yeah.

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Hi Jack, I think we haven't been seeing each other for more than 10 years.

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Oh yeah.

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You look terrific today, so I'm very happy.

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I believe you went through a lot of difficult things in past 10 years.

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So you also mentioned one day you will write a book.

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So my question is, would you like to share just one thing with us first?

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And you will do differently, you know, for something, one thing.

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Okay.

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Yeah, okay.

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All right.

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Thank you, Michelle.

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Right, Michelle Tan?

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Yes.

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Thank you.

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We know, not see for 10 years.

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Yeah, we've gone through a lot of tough days.

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If today, when something is smooth, I just feel uncomfortable.

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That's true.

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In the US, I call it very paranoid, I am, yeah.

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But the mistake we made a lot for Yahoo China.

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I think when we acquired Yahoo China, if people ask me whether we will do it again, yes, I will.

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But whether we would do it in this way, no I won't.

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We would do a much better smart way because we had no any experience of acquisition,

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especially acquire an internet company.

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And we made a lot of mistakes there and that helped us today.

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So when you ask me about whether I'm interested in Yahoo, yes of course.

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I think we are probably one of the very few companies really understand Yahoo USA very well because of that.

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And people say, well, Yahoo China is terrible, how could you still talk about that?

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I mean, terrible running.

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No, it's not terrible running.

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We saw problems four years ago, so we cut Yahoo China.

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If we did not, we would have died today.

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So we would share these mistakes, how we acquire, how we treat the culture things, how we fight people.

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We should fight some people earlier, we should keep some people.

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There's a lot of detailed things.

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I believe any companies in the future will learn.

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And I think today I'm not talking about Yahoo USA,

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but we think about how internet companies in the USA and China should learn from Yahoo.

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We all face the same challenge if we do not learn the mistakes the other people make.

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So that's, that's I think I want to share with the mistakes.

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Thank you.

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Thank you.

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Hi Jack, I had three quick questions.

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The first is Taobao has been incredibly successful.

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How do you manage and prevent it from being the victim of its own success? how do you stay nimble?

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eBay itself has sort of stagnated as it got this large.

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Second is, given the competitive landscape with companies like 360 Buy, will you be forced to do more on the logistics side, take title?

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We'll all be forced to what?

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Forced to build out your own logistics, take title, and therefore that change your model.

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And last is, I've read a lot of things about your account of what went on with Alipay.

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It'd be interesting to hear if you could do it over again.

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What would you have hoped Masha

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and Jerry would have said to you? how would you have wished

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that dialogue would have gone as opposed to the way it actually went?

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Okay, the first, Taobao, yeah, Taobao grows so fast and will grow even faster in the future.

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The big challenge is that we have never run such a huge company.

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And I don't believe the internet time there's empire thinking.

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I hate the empire.

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My empire thinking is join me or I'll kill you.

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And I don't like the model.

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I believe the ecosystem, I'm the board member for TNC, the Nature Conservancy.

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I believe that everybody should be connected to each other, help each other, it's an ecosystem.

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So Taobao becomes so big so fast, and I worry about that.

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I should give the industry some opportunity, give the competitors some opportunities.

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So in June, we separate the top ball into four paths.

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Because people talk to me, they say, Jack, you've been there for nine years.

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It's very difficult to compete with you because you're already so big.

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So okay, I make it smaller, you compete.

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If 10 years later, I'm still bigger than that, I will put another three pieces each.

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Making sure we run big company like a small company.

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Giving the people, the young people opportunities to run the business, because it's their business.

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Taobao, like Facebook, like Google, like Tiencen, they are not Chinese companies.

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They do not belong to China, they do not belong to the US, they belong this time, 21st century.

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You have to using a different way to run this company.

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Honestly say what is the best methodology, what is the best mental thinking to run that company, I don't know.

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We are testing and we are ready to take mistakes.

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So we believe the ecosystem, we do not believe the empire thinking.

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So that's why we are testing everywhere we could.

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And second question is that leaving the competition, 365?

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Yeah, will you be forced to take time?

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Right, change your model.

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I think they should change their model.

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It's not about, it's not about, I don't feel anything wrong with Taobao model.

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We are growing, we can make money very easily, and we can support more people.

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So, I don't know we should change our model, and I don't buy this story about buying things and selling online.

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This is really stupid model on the internet and I don't like that.

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And logistic things, I tell you, last year, the total China package delivered on the street is 2 .1 billion package delivered.

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Taobao created nearly 1 .1 billion.

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And this year, we will probably create 3 billion package delivered on the street.

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That we do not want to have our own logistic system.

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China probably needs 10 million people to live on the street.

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How can we run a company with 10 million employees?

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Right, 20 ,000 people today we have, we have 23 ,000 people, it's already a big headache to me.

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So 10 million, crazy, nobody can do that.

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So we should support the logistic companies to serve well.

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To deliver well, to treat their employees well, the customer well, this is what we want to do.

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We do not want to have our own logistic companies, never ever.

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So we have the money, we have the inference, we have the orders, how we can improve the society.

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This is, and to Ali, Pai, Ma, and Jerry, I think I have answered that many times, but I can't answer you again.

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They are good friends, they're good partners.

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And I understand at the beginning, I said, Jack, how could you that?

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Even today the VI is too poor about it.

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But I got clear message, you see, yes and no. So I told them, I think today they are happy.

444

Now I'm not happy because I'm getting such a big burden for Alipid because today Alipid grow very fast, but it's not a big nice model yet.

445

You cannot make money out of it.

446

But we are supposed to pay that much money at the end to the company.

447

And I say challenge is a challenge, young guys, let's create a good model for that.

448

So I think it's a very healthy discussion between Jerry, Massa, and us.

449

But unfortunately, the rumor was out that I moved the company out without the board meeting, without notice.

450

I tell the truth.

451

They know, and we discussed together.

452

And today, the problem solved, they're happy.

453

I'm half burnt. But it's a challenge.

454

Michelle, I've faced a lot of tough days.

455

This is one of the tough things I have to face.

456

Cuz it's easy for other guys, well, you should do this, you should do that.

457

When you know if Alipay die, Taobao die.

458

If Taobao die, eight million power sellers in trouble.

459

And I cannot do that.

460

And if I do not follow China law, I will drink coffee in Beijing every week.

461

Everybody wanted me to sit in there and drinking coffee and they say, Jack, where you get bigger, you're in trouble. Be transparent.

462

Today, 21st century, everything should be transparent.

463

Otherwise, why we should work so hard for?

464

So, that's what I'm telling.

465

I think there's no other way I can zig around.

466

I just say this is the reality, we have to face it.

467

I hope I answered your question.

468

Thank you.

469

Thank you very much for the wonderful speech.

470

My question is how Taobao evaluate international collaborations in technology?

471

Because I heard Taobao now is still not open API for foreign countries.

472

I mean non -Chinese countries

473

So as it means non -Chinese countries not able to launch their products based on Taobao platform

474

So I want to hear your opinion about this.

475

Thanks.

476

Okay, I'd love to we'd love to open the API for the non -Chinese country Unfortunately, it's about the payment It's very difficult.

477

I have, when I travel around, I saw so many overseas Chinese, they say, Taobao is wonderful, can we buy things outside China,

478

sell things, and a lot of foreign.

479

We are trying our best.

480

And we think that if the payment is soft, things could be moved much faster.

481

And Taobao will never stay alone in China.

482

I said Taobao does not belong to China, it comes from China, it belongs to the whole world.

483

It belongs to this generation.

484

Let's make sure in the future it can help more people because things really cool on Taobao.

485

Thank you.

486

Thanks so much.

487

Yeah.

488

Hi, Jack.

489

Actually, my question is kind of similar with hers, but - You want to buy things from here from Taobao?

490

No, but of course I want to, right?

491

Thank you Taobao, it improved my life.

492

Okay, so my question is that you have said that there is no difficult business in the world.

493

But the truth is for a lot of foreign companies, it's really difficult to do business in China.

494

And we have a lot of clients, they want to go to China and actually luckily Taobao,

495

Ali Group can provide the whole solution for them actually from the high china from alipay from everything

496

but it's hard for them to know they are there is a choice

497

and it's hard for them to kind of cross the policy part

498

or government part so what's you do you have any plan to help those foreign companies

499

because chinese still has a needs for the foreign products Okay, thank you very much.

500

I think doing business is difficult in anywhere in the world.

501

Foreign companies go to China, find problems, and I think, and I believe Chinese company come to US and do business also facing big problems.

502

I don't see any very successful Chinese companies in USA.

503

I mean, we come here in the USA.

504

Is there any famous Chinese companies that come to USA or A European that is very good.

505

Huawei.

506

Alibaba.

507

Alibaba.

508

Not yet, not yet, right.

509

Lenovo?

510

Lenovo.

511

Do you call that successful?

512

No. All right.

513

My thinking was that in China we do have some successful foreign companies, right?

514

Microsoft is not bad.

515

IBM is not bad, and we have a lot of Oracle, a lot of great companies, and a foreign company in China, very successful.

516

Guys, going anywhere, doing business, takes time.

517

I think my friend Kara Fisher asked me about question in the D conference.

518

No market welcomes gamblers.

519

You go there, create value for local people, have time, it will have chance.

520

So I believe that doing business today and everywhere in the world is difficult.

521

China's, my wife and I was debating yesterday morning when I was driving, she's saying, no, it's so difficult to do business in the USA because there are the Walmart chain,

522

whatever chain, everything's a chain, even the coffee's a chain.

523

He said, how can you have a small business?

524

And I said, wow, in the USA it's easy for small business to do.

525

So there's a professor sitting next to us, we should have a big debate.

526

Which country is easier to do business, USA or China?

527

And I think China today,

528

if you still think about we should follow the government policy, forget it.

529

I've said again and again in the past 12 years, every time I speak out of China, if you meet somebody come to you and say,

530

I have a strong guanxi with that mayor, forget about this guy.

531

The only guanxi is the guanxi with the customer.

532

If the customer love you, the government will better love you.

533

Trust me, they need the tax, they need the jobs.

534

But if you want to pick around, you know, you're in trouble.

535

So I don't believe that, because my relationship with the government in the past 12 years,

536

so in love with them, don't marry them, always.

537

I love them.

538

Every time they come, I tell them the truth.

539

I do everything they tell me, yeah, okay, right, let's communicate.

540

But do business, sorry.

541

My friend does business with government, not me.

542

In this way, you get respect from them.

543

If this is that serious about Alipay, let's listen to them, because it's law.

544

It's not government .

545

So I give you advice, it's always scared, looking far away.

546

My god, this is a difficult place.

547

Go there, test.

548

Jump in, you never learn swim until you get to swim you're in the water.

549

China's not that bad.

550

But people ask me why China has no apple.

551

USA have capitalism for more than 200 years, right?

552

That thick fertilizers, people company die, grow, die, grow, that thick fertilizer.

553

China only 30 years after reformed Deng Xiaoping.

554

30 years have a company like a Tesla, Baidu, Alibaba, Sina, not bad, right?

555

So let's wait for another 30 years.

556

We will have them.

557

And that is not China, that belongs to the world because it belongs to the internet at the time,

558

belongs to the young people who are born 1990s and 1980s, 2000.

559

These are the people going to change the world, especially most of the students here.

560

And they are the future.

561

I believe that.

562

Thank you.

563

Thank you.

564

I used the work at eBay and PayPal.

565

I know how much challenge you have.

566

back to 2000, I don't know, do you remember, you have the TV advertisement in Australia, that is two months before Sydney Olympic,

567

I have a business trip there.

568

So at that time, Alibaba just have two years old, so you have the ambition to have a globalization at that time.

569

So now, after 10, 12 years, right, Alibaba has more power to have globalization.

570

What is your future plan for the global growing strategy and I think that's it.

571

Okay, thank you.

572

Yeah, you're right.

573

When we have money, we start to make mistakes.

574

When we have money, we have a beautiful office.

575

We hire people with MBA degree.

576

We hire people as the VP of multinational companies.

577

And we always have a little bit money, only have five minutes, we start thinking about globalization.

578

Jesus.

579

And then we said, let's back to basic, B2C, back to China.

580

Year 2002.

581

I remember we called that time called B2C, back to China, back to basic, back to base, right?

582

Back to central of China, the coast area, back to coast area.

583

Because we told ourselves global vision, local win.

584

No matter how wonderful you think, you have to step on the ground and do the things, the hard work every day.

585

So many years passed, 12 years passed.

586

We still believe global vision, local win.

587

But we tested in Japan,

588

we tested Indian, we tested European and we tested also in past 12 years we never shut down the US office.

589

I'm now coming out for one year, I want to learn one thing.

590

And I want to ask this thing, everyone here, sure.

591

Fortune 500 CEOs in the world, they all believe China is a big, interesting market.

592

But nobody really give up things and come to China.

593

to spend one year there.

594

Because if you really want to know China, you've got to spend some time. And me too.

595

And I'm asking USA, European, it's going to be a big market for us.

596

And I just want to put down everything, spend time in USA for one year.

597

Get feeling how we can help the USA SME.

598

How we can help the US, what's the difference we can do between Amazon, eBay, and us?

599

What's the real value we can create?

600

When you think about that clearly, let's start to do it.

601

Cuz we never should finish a 20 year program in two years.

602

Life is short, but life is long.

603

You cannot say I wanna finish that in two years.

604

We have time.

605

I'm that old, but I'm still young.

606

I have time, yeah.

607

So we will go step by step, not asking about how much revenue we can bring out of China.

608

We will ask what value we really can bring to local people.

609

And we have already more than 50 million small business outside China using our services and we do not charge them.

610

And freedom, free is always the best.

611

We will work on that, thank you.

612

Thank you.

613

Yeah.

614

Thank you.

615

Jack, .

616

I just welcome Jack to the US and said I hope he can have a good rest while he's here.

617

So my question for you is, what do you think is the biggest misunderstanding that America has about China?

618

And conversely, what do you think is the biggest misunderstanding that China has about America?

619

Honestly, I don't know that question.

620

I think there are a lot of misunderstanding, but I was thinking about few days ago writing something on my Weibo.

621

Everybody believe that I know the world.

622

I know China completely inside out.

623

No, you don't.

624

Don Xiaoping did not know, Mao Zedong did not know, nobody know China.

625

And everybody say, I know USA inside out.

626

No, you don't know, Obama does not know, otherwise he will turn US out.

627

Right?

628

John Bush did not know.

629

It's very difficult to know the outside, but you know yourself.

630

What do you need?

631

What do you want?

632

What will you give up?

633

If I know myself better.

634

I can change myself to meet the outside.

635

There's always misunderstanding between China and the US, just like there's always misunderstanding between Henan people and Chinese.

636

Right?

637

Our job is not to solve the misunderstanding.

638

Our job is to change ourselves to suit the others.

639

So, I don't know.

640

But if that's why this is a good question.

641

I come in here because I see so many American people think of China and they have never been to China.

642

A lot of Chinese people could criticize US, they've never been to the States.

643

So if we do not learn to appreciate each other, to look at each other.

644

And the more I spend the states, the more I love the USA.

645

And the more I come to China, I say, well, it's communication.

646

So political wise, political is very difficult.

647

But there's only one thing that I think I would be very happy to do, business.

648

I don't like online gaming.

649

I think, I believe the best gaming on the world is to making money.

650

Helping small business cross the ocean.

651

Doing business make them understand each other.

652

My grandfather know news by reading newspaper.

653

My father know news by listening to the radio.

654

Our generation know the world by watching TV.

655

Our kids know the world by the internet.

656

They say I want to involve.

657

And I believe this is the time, let's build up the internet.

658

Anything happen in the USA, we know in China immediately.

659

Anything happen in China, most of the things you know very quickly.

660

Well, let's, don't laugh, let's appreciate most of the things.

661

Let's appreciate that.

662

Doing things step by step is important, instead of get everything one night.

663

Thank you.

664

Last one.

665

Yeah, sorry.

666

Jack, you mentioned that you spent some time here in the early days of Alibaba

667

and that you were rejected by a lot of venture capitalists who you met with.

668

But there was one investor here in Silicon Valley who played a big role in Alibaba's success, which was Jerry Yang and Yahoo,

669

who invested, I believe, a billion dollars into Alibaba in 2005.

670

Can you talk about your relationship with Jerry, how that investment came about, and and what your relationship was like with him now, and how integral that investment has been to Alibaba's growth and success?

671

Okay, first, Jerry is a very good friend of mine, personal friend.

672

Lifetime, lifetime friend.

673

We have families also are good friends.

674

And, but it's nothing personal, it's all about business, right?

675

Yahoo invested us year 2005, I think it benefited both sides.

676

Without Yahoo, USA's investment, we will not be that successful today.

677

Because we need, we not need the cash to solve our problem.

678

We need that cash to solve the venture capital problem.

679

They did not see Alibaba has a future, they want to cash up.

680

So they helped us that, not on the business side, mainly.

681

And without Yahoo deal, we would never learn how to partner with a big company.

682

What's the big company's problem?

683

How we can improve our own culture and things?

684

But in the future, if it was today's situation, we do not change.

685

We will not have a bright future.

686

We have to do something.

687

So I think fairly speaking, we appreciate yesterday, but we are looking for a better tomorrow.

688

Every company should do that.

689

And today, and Jerry, and we're still pretty close friends.

690

And we talk, we chat, we play golf, maybe.

691

In the future, the same.

692

And we like Yahoo.

693

I think this is Yahoo is the company me,

694

at least one of the three companies that wake me up about Internet.

695

And I appreciate that all my life.

696

Without Internet, there will be no Jack Ma and there will be no Alibaba, Talbot.

697

So that's what my answer is.

698

Thank you very much.

699

We have time.

700

I think Cara has a question from all things Lisa.

701

It's your friend Cara Swisher.

702

Yes.

703

How you doing?

704

So two quick questions.

705

So you talked about you're interested in buying Yahoo.

706

One, have you visited Yahoo on this trip?

707

And two, how are you going to buy Yahoo?

708

I'm interested in buying Yahoo, but it's not happening.

709

I answer my question in a very honest way.

710

First question, no. Okay.

711

I've been here for 15 days.

712

Yeah.

713

And most of time, sleeping and reading.

714

Okay.

715

No, I don't have time to, I think sleeping is more important now than, because they're going to be tough, long way to go.

716

Okay.

717

Second, your question is about how.

718

How?

719

We are interested in getting the whole.

720

The whole?

721

Yeah.

722

Whole piece.

723

The whole piece of your Yahoo China stake or the whole piece of all of Yahoo?

724

Whole piece of Yahoo.

725

Yahoo China is already ours, right?

726

It's already in my pocket.

727

Right.

728

The only thing I gotta say is thank you and all this confusion for the first crystal clear answer about Yahoo, about the company.

729

I appreciate it as a reporter.

730

So when's that gonna happen?

731

I don't know.

732

Honestly, I don't know because it's more complicated than we thought.

733

And there's so many people interested in that.

734

And we are also talking to them and they are talking to us.

735

And we think that it's, I was told it's so difficult.

736

It's not about money issues, it's about political issues inside a social board.

737

So I cross my finger just to say we are very, very interested in that.

738

Okay, perfect, thanks, Jack.

739

Thank you.

O que é a Técnica de Shadowing?

Shadowing é uma técnica de aprendizado de idiomas com base científica, originalmente desenvolvida para o treinamento de intérpretes profissionais. O método é simples, mas poderoso: você ouve áudio em inglês nativo e repete imediatamente em voz alta — como uma sombra seguindo o falante com 1-2 segundos de atraso. Pesquisas mostram melhora significativa na precisão da pronúncia, entonação, ritmo, sons conectados, compreensão auditiva e fluência na fala.

Prática de Shadowing: Alibaba's Ma Reflects On 12-Year Journey at China 2.0 Conference - Aprenda a falar inglês com vídeo

O cenário: Uma conversa autêntica sobre jornada empresarial

Trechos úteis e colocações para memorizar

Seu desafio de shadowing: Repita e imite a fluidez

O que é a Técnica de Shadowing?