쉐도잉 연습: Robert Downey Jr. & Mark Ruffalo | Actors on Actors - 영상으로 영어 말하기 배우기
레슨 만드는 중...
1
on one of these Avengers movies you like take off your shirt
2
or thing and you're you're you're in really good shape
3
and the director was like we got it you're like can I please stop dieting
4
and working out now exactly there is no one I've ever
5
come across who is actually more anxious to not be vain
6
past the point where it is necessary to achieve an end for their work is that a compliment It's a huge compliment.
7
Robert Downey Jr. and I met in 1995.
8
Yep.
9
And I was dating an old friend of his.
10
Yes.
11
Sunrise Kuan Yeh.
12
Correct.
13
who was close with my previous administration, Deborah Falconer.
14
And we were over at, I think, well, it was that beautiful kind of Spanish style on the hills.
15
On Grace Avenue.
16
That's right.
17
Grace Avenue.
18
And Sonny brought me over to meet Debbie.
19
And you came by and I was like, holy shit, that's Robert Downey.
20
And Sonny was like, hey, Robert.
21
Yeah, don't flatter me too much we were already hearing about this Mark Ruffalo guy who was making a splash
22
and was going to be on the come up.
23
Yeah.
24
You didn't buy that.
25
Do you want me to try another take?
26
No, no. I was just bartending at that time.
27
And that's what I hear about me.
28
But Sonny did see something in me.
29
Yeah.
30
Really, I would say we knew each other,
31
ancillary reasons but we really met when Fincher cast us in Zodiac yeah
32
and I remember Mark is doing a scene in a phone booth about take 218
33
and I'm visiting San Francisco because I'm about to start right
34
and I could just see the character that you had built
35
and I was like oh my god I I better find one.
36
That's great.
37
You are amazing.
38
The minute we, didn't we do a table read too?
39
Yes.
40
Yeah, we did that table read.
41
And that was, that movie was, what a wild ride that was.
42
Yeah.
43
I called Fincher recently because in retrospect, everything changes.
44
It's like 15 years later, you have such a different perspective on stuff, you know, and then for me even after working with nolan i developed a new respect for fincher
45
but i remember
46
that was maybe the first time we really had our feet
47
put to the fire with an exacting director a real director who does things a certain way
48
and i mean the result was you know people still say
49
that scene with you and ruffalo in the parking lot
50
or those scenes and blah blah blah
51
and i kind of go like i just have a vague memory of it all yeah me too
52
but that is on the top level of so many people's uh favorites
53
and i have a story to tell okay okay we're shooting a scene in the mail room
54
and we've done it about 60 times 60 yeah
55
and you know mark's been working a bunch of days in a row i'm feeling a bit uh mischievous
56
and he's like we got it right
57
and i was like yeah this is ridiculous
58
and then fincher says well do we got it he was
59
down he come here i want the scene to start like
60
because i wanted to work out you want it to work as a one-er no we don't have it
61
and he And he goes, Downey says we don't have it.
62
So Mark, you can go to lunch.
63
We'll scrap all those takes and we'll start over again.
64
Exactly.
65
And he invented the delete button.
66
There was no delete button ever in digital cinema.
67
And he specifically had it invented so that he could say, we're gonna delete takes one through 45.
68
And you're just like, no, no, no, no. But you know, why is it?
69
38 was my baby.
70
But isn't it because some part of this just wants to be off the hot seat and done.
71
And we also know that there's always that thing of you, A, you wanna make mom or dad happy,
72
B, you kind of just, it's not that you wanna be done, it's that you wanna feel that there's progress that's being made because you're helping.
73
Yes, and you just want someone to say that was good enough, let's move on.
74
Do you feel like after all this time that you still have that kind of, that sort of push and pull with it? Of course.
75
Yeah, everything is,
76
it's a constant battle between either seeking approval or seeking my own subjective kind of like
77
being able to maintain interest over time, you know?
78
And then we had this on this whole decade and a half Marvel run
79
where we were just looking at each other like, God, we're really lucky.
80
what are we doing?
81
Who's a wizard?
82
Who's coming from outer space?
83
Which I think was another great challenge.
84
Yeah.
85
From where we came from.
86
Yeah.
87
I mean, I'll never forget, you know, you, we don't have to go down this road,
88
but you, you, you, to see this great, um, character in the actor
89
who was always doing this great character work so alive
90
so um relatable so human to take that step into a studio world
91
which was totally different back then than it is now
92
and you and i know what
93
that is it was such a different world they didn't really cast people like like us
94
and And just to see you transform
95
that whole concept of what a studio picture was and to elevate sort of this character work within that big tentpole system,
96
which appealed so massively to so many different people and made the space for other people like us that, you know, I'll never forget.
97
I was like, I don't know if I'm right for this.
98
And you're like, come on, Ruffalo.
99
We got this.
100
Yeah, how's that new brownstone on the Upper West Side?
101
Thank you.
102
Yeah, please, dude.
103
I mean, I don't know who thinks who.
104
It's just kind of, it really is odd for those watching at home.
105
It is a surreal experience to be sitting here with you, lo these years later.
106
and now to both be here on behalf of projects
107
that I think we're so proud of and are done by such gifted filmmakers
108
and you know you kind of wonder right like didn't I
109
already have my act too isn't this the slow decline
110
if they foamed the runway
111
so back to your first question is of course there's it's
112
nowhere to live though right it's nowhere to live thinking your your best days or your best creative moments are behind you, A, it's not true, and B, it's just debilitating.
113
Yeah, which is why I even brought this up.
114
Because, you know, you've done it all.
115
I mean, you have it all.
116
You don't have to prove anything to anybody.
117
Dad, oh no, go ahead.
118
Well, dad even, to some degree.
119
You got that at the end, you know?
120
Sure.
121
In the most beautiful way, right?
122
And then you come and you do this part in Oppenheimer.
123
Dr. Oppenheimer.
124
An honor.
125
Mr. Strass.
126
It's pronounced Strasser.
127
It's just another level, you know, it's just, it's just, you, you break it all down.
128
You put yourself out in a way that you didn't have to.
129
We see a total character, a physical change, a vocal change,
130
um a different kind of guy none of the mannerisms of anything
131
that we'd ever seen before that you that you had perfected and had become so second nature to you
132
and they had that kind of discipline and
133
that kind of of reach for that next thing is really admirable
134
and why I have always looked up to you and why I continue to look up to you.
135
And that thing still, I mean, talk about that.
136
Like, what was that?
137
Why is that still alive?
138
I mean, look, and then we'll move on to a far more interesting subject.
139
which is you and poor things.
140
All I know is I got a call.
141
Chris Nolan had a new kind of what it was.
142
I went over to his house.
143
It was black type on red paper, you know, and they send it like that so you can't copy it.
144
It was like Sudoku to get through 180 pages.
145
And I left there just knowing I was going to do it.
146
And everybody and, you know, Susan and everyone was like, you need a challenge like this.
147
And I go, I don't like it when everyone else is telling me what I need.
148
And the truth be told is it all wound up to I've tried everything else.
149
How about trying to really focus on doing as little as possible just once?
150
And correspondingly, I have, I've known you a long time.
151
I know what you're like when you're feeling froggy and you're kind of having a good time and you're loose.
152
And I know what you're like.
153
I know what you're like when you're pensive.
154
I know what you're like when you're concerned about the state of the world.
155
I know what you're like when you're comfortable with homeostasis.
156
But I did not know that this character existed inside of you.
157
You were in my son.
158
What?
159
I remember how apprehensive you were about doing this too, just as I had all this approach to anxiety.
160
Did you have that apprehension too?
161
For Louis Strauss, of course.
162
Yes.
163
because you always wonder someone else believes in you you know
164
that person is formidable you've seen their other work you go wow this is like an opportune moment
165
and yet it's natural to have that
166
doubt yeah and i'm interested to know for duncan how you got past that approach anxiety because
167
you're just you're such a thoughtful guy and you're one of the people
168
that i always say has such a strong and formidable moral psychology and you really don't make decisions lightly.
169
So knowing what an absolute archetype,
170
cad, misogynist, self-centered, shaming, blaming guide,
171
but you redeemed it with this spark that was so delightful.
172
I mean, I can't tell you what What a joy it was watching you in this and seeing the whole arc, the way you constructed it.
173
But I wanna know what it was like before, during and after.
174
It did scare the shit out of me.
175
And I did say, well, you know, this isn't the kind of guy I play.
176
You know, I had all that.
177
I'm embarrassed to say.
178
And Sunny and my wife, Sunrise, was like, have to do this
179
and everyone was like you have to do it just like you you have to do it
180
but you really have to get outside of your comfort zone
181
and you also start to doubt yourself like you're saying you know you hit 55
182
and you are kind of like maybe it's as good as
183
i'll get maybe i am on the downward slide of this thing
184
and i also at that time was like really kind of tired of
185
my brand or you know whatever people you put on yourself.
186
Yeah and isn't it funny when our wives will flat out say just don't worry everyone else is tired of it too.
187
That's why you need to do this.
188
But with Yorgos
189
and McNamara I think you obviously had just two amazing partners in knowing how it would be executed
190
and what was in the text.
191
And I've gotten to speak at least to McNamara recently.
192
So what was that process like for you just a little bit?
193
And at what point in the shoot did you feel like, oh, okay, I'm cooking with gas.
194
Now I get it.
195
I don't even know what scene you shot first.
196
I would love to just know that.
197
Well, we had this amazing rehearsal period, which we've never had.
198
And it was literally 10 days of just theater games.
199
Dancing, singing, movement, playing with each other's faces and bodies and then playing together as a group.
200
And then we probably spent maybe only 20% on the actual script.
201
And when we did read the script, we were telling people you have to raise your voice.
202
Anytime you lifted your hand, that person have to raise their voice when they were doing the line.
203
You had to touch someone's face when you were doing the line in the middle of a line, say, this is the most beautiful part of you.
204
And and it's so it just like it obliterated your ideas of what you think it should be.
205
Right.
206
And the script is still there living in you.
207
So as you're playing the character
208
and the story is still kind of like surfacing its way up through the subconscious a little bit
209
and you just get really free and you could go broad
210
or you could go small and no one's judging you know everyone's laughing
211
or they're not and there's no you can't do anything wrong you can't do anything right really
212
and then you have those great words like the script is
213
really telling you a lot i mean who gets to say you know some stuff I say.
214
The first day though, it was a screen test that turned into our first day.
215
Yurgos had built it, Yurgos Lathimos had built it as a screen test.
216
But we're in full costume, full set, full everybody, everyone's there.
217
And it's a scene between me and Willem.
218
Okay, yeah.
219
It's the first time.
220
It's the only scene we really have together.
221
Yeah.
222
And I'm sweating bullets.
223
I am shitting my pants.
224
I'm like, what in the hell am I doing here?
225
I like that Willem is in full SFX makeup and you're sweating.
226
And he's sitting there like this.
227
Really?
228
And your girl comes up to me, he's like, oh, what are you doing?
229
And I said, I don't know.
230
He said, you already did this in rehearsal.
231
You know what you're doing.
232
And then he walked away.
233
So wait, break that down.
234
What did that mean and why did it help?
235
You know, you get in front of the camera and then you're just, I gotta be.
236
You gotta do something.
237
I have to do something.
238
God, man, we're literally on the same page.
239
Right?
240
It's crazy.
241
I have to do something.
242
And he was like, you don't have to do anything.
243
You did it.
244
You are it.
245
Don't do anything.
246
Don't do the look.
247
You don't have to tell us what's going on here.
248
Just trust what we did.
249
And he scrapped that first day.
250
I had to reshoot the first day.
251
Great.
252
It wasn't the first day.
253
It was a screen test, Mark.
254
It was a screen test.
255
Wow.
256
I wish every first day was a screen test.
257
I know.
258
I would, isn't it a genius?
259
Yeah.
260
I have to say, I also stole from you in this.
261
Great.
262
Some of Sherlock Holmes, Charlie Chaplin.
263
I mean, you, more than any other actor, you have this kind of physical mischief.
264
You know, you know the cad very well.
265
It's the gift that keeps on giving, isn't it?
266
It's beautiful.
267
Well, thanks for that.
268
I mean, we're all always drawing from myriad influences, conscious and otherwise, you know.
269
But again, it's so funny how, because I remember seeing you on screen first.
270
And I know right when I was starting off, I seemed to have this ability to say, be subtle, do less, let the emotion come to the forefront.
271
Sometimes I watch stuff I did when I was younger and I just go, well, that's how you should do it.
272
What the hell am I doing nowadays?
273
And obviously we fall into ruts and patterns.
274
But, you know, with Nolan, very much unlike Yorgos, but also effective,
275
we were doing screen tests on IMAX, which is crazy.
276
So, you know that you're being captured in like a David Lean sort of format.
277
And some part of you is going, what's this going to be like? you're just trusting the director and hoiteman hoitema who obviously this is what they do
278
and when they go this is good that's good you're kind of like all right
279
so i'm off the hook and you would go back
280
and sit in your set chair no you wouldn't
281
because there were no set chairs so it was very spartan
282
and very like a hundred people making a watch every day
283
so and i've had experiences like you discussed and i love
284
that feeling like i'm going back to basics in a sense of play and melding with the cast.
285
And I think because of the nature and the scope of what Chris was doing,
286
there honestly just wasn't time for that or money or energy or whatever.
287
And the schedule actually became even more truncated for reasons as we approached shooting.
288
So then it felt like every day we were just doing something that he knew what he was after.
289
He had written it, He was directing it and it was very small amount of people on set.
290
And I liked that too, because that reminds me of being a kid with my dad.
291
And it's, it's him and his cameraman and the editor and some college dropouts, gaffers.
292
And like, it's just kind of like, let's try something, you know.
293
I had no idea there was that kind of intimacy.
294
When I think of his films, I'm just seeing this like mass scale, but yeah that's
295
that makes a lot of sense yeah
296
because there are some really intimate performances in that film
297
and i i was wondering how did he how did they
298
how are they able to settle down with such a big production around them
299
because it's all he cares about and he demands
300
and requires this almost monastic energy so you know they're beyond no frills
301
which as we know having been very well taken care of
302
in certain situations you kind of feel like you're being stripped of your armor
303
which he does intentionally but he also does it just
304
so there's this it just creates a different vibe
305
and then you're moving at such a clip that you realize
306
if you're not getting and staying in the zone
307
and not checking your phone
308
and not hanging out a craft service oh there is no craft service
309
that you're going to miss the pace of what he's doing
310
but at the same time i've never ever in my career
311
worked with a less judgmental director i've been in situations
312
that were exacting and it seemed like
313
if i would just do it correctly one time we wouldn't have to still be here whereas
314
that was the exact opposite he said we do all these things to give you the time you need
315
and see what kind of time you might need
316
or i might want and all that stuff so i felt
317
that there was both in in poor things and i facetimed uh emma
318
and uh really want to reach out to everyone
319
but it was this thing where y'all seem to have this very concise execution
320
but you feel all the sense of play in it
321
and you feel the you know it was a really a
322
high wire rack was it fun it must have been fun
323
oh it was the time of my life i mean once i got to play
324
that guy with no sense of self-consciousness
325
or you know no sense of morality really no sense no sense of any bounds whatsoever
326
that hold us you know but you redeemed him because there's something
327
so lonely and it's almost like he wants to wake up but there's something that's happening or happened and But also,
328
I have never seen you play someone who is hopelessly hung up on something he can't control.
329
And I think it was genius casting because it was this thing that I could, there's a version of you where if Sonny had rejected your advances,
330
you may have pined after her for a decade.
331
Totally lost.
332
I'd still be living in the garage that she found me in.
333
Oh, brother.
334
It's beautiful.
335
and um yes it was a blast it was it was such a gift
336
and it was such a you know
337
that moment where you're like i don't know what
338
which way to go anymore i don't you know i don't even know how i feel about this anymore
339
and then i know you dude even that that senior on the bench
340
and you're yelling the c word
341
and i'm just like this is not my brother here like
342
it's just not in your wheelhouse to think to act
343
or behave that way so were you ever feeling like
344
if not self-conscious about it a little bit like i don't even know
345
if this is something i'm going to do as an exercise
346
because i would not want to ever normalize this yeah on screen or in my eye so i'm wondering well
347
then we're also living in this just incredibly oppressive feeling time yeah
348
and it just does not allowed a room to be a human being anymore it feels like
349
and that goes from art to society to i mean it's just it just feels incredibly impressive
350
and something about that movie is like just it's just like you know fighting out against it
351
and and it's it's walking like a disaster there is a disastrous self-destructive quality about it you know that felt so
352
antithetical to the this oppressive time that we're living in even though the character is
353
so dark and so up and so selfish and
354
so all the things that we're supposed not supposed to be
355
But it's almost like you're behaviorally modeling the world that you're wondering about.
356
And blowing it open.
357
Yeah.
358
You know, all the eyes are on us.
359
Everyone's eyes are on us all the time.
360
And we have to be a certain way.
361
And we have to look a certain way.
362
And we have to sound a certain way.
363
And our cabinets have got to be stocked with a certain kind of product.
364
And, you know?
365
This sounds very mid-century to me.
366
And it's just like, you know,
367
we're getting squashed into these boxes that don't let us express ourselves the way that we're made to express ourselves.
368
Your behavior is unconscionable.
369
We behave.
370
The food was cacking my throat.
371
The baby annoying.
372
that was my experience of getting to say the c word
373
at the top of my lungs getting to be a cad
374
because it's underneath all that is still a humanity all of
375
that behavior there's still a humanity underneath that that was the thing is the fact that i'm feeling bad for
376
you in those moments and again it's so masterfully constructed
377
because of course it's a fable
378
but it's it's really underselling it to call it a fable
379
and the fact that with all of the indulgences
380
that occur it doesn't feel exploitative of the artists of the medium it feels very much like a
381
reverse empowerment story that you have to tell it in almost this kind of fantastic way
382
to be able to get all the information that's being downloaded.
383
So there's just so much wisdom in there.
384
That's such a great way of expressing.
385
But hats off to you, dude.
386
Hats off to you, man.
387
Seriously, Robert, it's a you're you're one of those fine artists who is constantly growing
388
as they move through their career.
389
That's rare.
390
And you are that.
391
And I love you for it.
392
And you have everything, Robert.
393
You don't need to do that.
394
What a terrible place to be.
395
What do you mean?
396
To quote unquote, if it's true, to be said about any of us to have everything.
397
Is that sense of completion?
398
And also convincing myself, I should be perfectly happy as I have everything.
399
And yet you go like, we know where the work is that's left to be done.
400
I know those little corners that I sweep the dust into that.
401
I spent a lot of time making sure nobody sees.
402
I know if not the defects, I know the things that I haven't really looked at.
403
And again, you know, the crazy thing for me is I've been obsessed for the last five to seven years before Chris called me, probably longer.
404
with the culture of the Cold War, because I felt it was so back upon us.
405
And so by the time Chris called, I actually knew a fair amount about Louis Strauss
406
because I had done a lot of deep dives into all the characters around this time, because I think it informed and then led to the Vietnam era,
407
which is the era that I slash we am older than you were born in
408
and was everything I was seeing on TV that wasn't a Nabisco commercial or a Charlie Brown cartoon
409
was this dark mistrust of our misplacing of our forefathers highest wishes and that kind of dark corruption and all that stuff.
410
So that has to be born out of this cold war
411
that is born out of looking for answers to the conflict of World War II.
412
And you were already down that road when this came along?
413
Yeah.
414
And I have to credit my deceased grandfather, Captain Robert Elias, who I never met.
415
I had this fascination with a grandfather that I had never met.
416
And I looked at pictures of him and it reminded me of dad.
417
And my dad told me about him.
418
And he was deployed in Sicily in North africa he was yeah around
419
and but then he became a glass manufacturer
420
and his big claim to fame was
421
that his family had done the glass for the chrysler building
422
and um my family painted the chrysler building they're construction painters
423
so you see the touch points that's how close we are to all this right yeah
424
and so that's you know light blue collar stuff to do
425
and please just punch about
426
that I think his his marriage to my grandmother who wound up being kind of like a vogue model
427
and a bit of an absentee parent to my dad no wonder he just kept going back overseas
428
because he didn't want to deal with a marriage that wasn't working
429
and so anyway always been into it but I've been doing this deep dive
430
so then I felt like I had a um an idea of someone who might have been back in time
431
and then louis strauss was the president of temple emmanuel
432
which we've walked by in new york a bunch yeah
433
and i just did my little louis strauss tour
434
and he's he's a kind of salieri kind of you know
435
that's what chris said well i'm here to tell you
436
that i know j robert oppenheimer
437
if he could do it all over he'd do it all the same what did you relate to in
438
that i mean bro come on i mean I mean, whether you're here or in New York, we will never forget.
439
And I think still are imbued with the sense of being on that outside looking in.
440
And when will it ever happen for us?
441
And so-and-so is doing it and so-and-so is doing it.
442
And I'm going to be left behind.
443
And why even bother to dream?
444
But the truth be told is he's both because he's a self-made guy who was a lifelong civil servant.
445
and but how refreshing it was to not be playing the genius the gifted one all
446
that stuff all the characters in the audience in the script imbues you with this status
447
that you not possess but you presume it
448
and I know what it's like to wish someone else hadn't embarrassed me in the street
449
wish that I'd gotten past that velvet rope to go into
450
that club wish that I'd gotten a call back for that part, wished that I'd gotten the second date with that girl, wished, wished, wished, wished, wished.
451
So unlike Strauss, I wasn't doing the right things while I was wondering why my life wasn't going the right way.
452
This is someone who, you know, from working for President Wilson to getting the Jewish refugees the notice they needed to be given support
453
when that wasn't even popular in the U S to this, to that, to this, every single step of his life, of course, was consciously looking toward a political payoff,
454
but he really just wanted to be acknowledged by the people that he admired.
455
And so Chris constructed this story to what happens
456
when people don't listen to each other and don't make space for each other.
457
Or in this case of someone who can't even relate to people
458
because he's got the weight of the world on his shoulders, but that still doesn't mean they don't feel like, Hey, you know what, if I get a chance to stick it to you I will because you embarrassed me three times
459
three times at my birthday party that you attended when you blow off me introducing my daughter
460
when you uh you know give me crap in the senate
461
and when I don't understand this conversation you're having
462
so anyway mid-century insanity and we're still living with it yeah it's such a great performance man.
463
Why do people not just do this all the time?
464
If we want to talk about Courage Under Fire, the fact that 11 seconds into this performance you are buck naked
465
and going for it in a way that again wasn't gratuitous but it was very
466
um how was that and is
467
that really how you get down um i don't know robert that's the
468
that to me is the ultimate risk it's
469
so uh it was the one part of the thing i
470
was like do i have to what are we gonna do
471
with this you know all i could hear is like nobody wants to see your old ass anymore.
472
You know, maybe you shouldn't be doing movies like that anymore.
473
I mean, it's my least favorite part of it, but, you know, I also saw it as very comedic,
474
you know, and also like an extension of the physical comedy that we're already sort of finding.
475
So it was just another way to tell the story.
476
I just want to say this too
477
because knowing you forever on one of these Avengers movies you like take off your shirt
478
or thing and you were you were you were in really good shape
479
and the director was I don't know
480
if it was uh we did it might have been Joss it might have been the Russo's
481
but anyway it's like we got it you're like oh can I please stop dieting and working out now.
482
There is no one I've ever come across who is actually more anxious to not be vain
483
past the point where it is necessary to achieve an end for their work.
484
Is that a compliment?
485
It's a huge compliment but I gotta say, A, you look pretty bangable to me, in case you were wondering.
486
Thanks man.
487
Because the guy, I mean, I mean yeah, yeah it was pretty good.
488
He is who he is.
489
And by the way the costumes, I don't even want to, if we start going down the road of just like
490
all of the delights of the department heads
491
and it was shot in budapest in budapest right
492
so you get all those artisans and you're all there
493
and just you're getting so much value
494
but it's still this kind of fantastical backgrounds but then everything you're physically seeing is just so
495
fine down to the detail i mean dude i'm just looking
496
i'm literally looking at the back of some of your jackets
497
going god i've never been able to wear a jacket the cool cut like that I was like, do you know I had an ass pad in?
498
I had my legs were like four inches bigger.
499
My calf was four.
500
I mean, he really wanted the silhouette.
501
So I was wearing a corset with like shoulder pads.
502
So I was so squeezed in.
503
Beautiful.
504
And you know, that whole, that was the corset.
505
That was the high collar.
506
It was the whole thing.
507
Are you wearing a corset in one of the scenes?
508
Yes, I wear a corset when I take off.
509
And that's, Duncan wears a corset, you know?
510
It's like kinda, yeah, I mean, that stuff was, it was even more extreme.
511
He wanted me to look like a bird, so I had this whole built out chest piece that I was wearing.
512
It never made it, because it was just, it was too much.
513
But the big ass pads, the leg pads, the thigh pads, the calf pads, those were all playing.
514
So when you look at that and you're like, wow, he looks great.
515
Now you know I was just wearing what the Avengers wear, but underneath my clothes.
516
Honestly, I didn't expect that there was any augmentation going on.
517
So it was done really well.
518
Yeah, but the bird chest would have been too much but I think I know what he was going for, particularly with all the hybrids that are occurring in the movie and the nature of it, you know?
519
Is just to tweak it.
520
But I love it when a director has an instinct that they go, I have this instinct, I'm sticking to it, I'm sticking to it, I'm wrong and they dump it.
521
That's when I begin to really trust someone is they are changeable and they're not fixed.
522
They're not obsessive, they're actually exploring, you know?
523
And Yorgos, we explored all the time.
524
It was all an exploration.
525
I just want to say before we run out on this card, so many of your scenes are with Emma Stone.
526
And I am pretty obsessed with her now.
527
I've always thought she was great, but this is just a this is just such a defining moment as an actor for her watching her.
528
And you have the joy and also the, you know, the the ability.
529
It seems like you guys just had this.
530
You had great chemistry.
531
Thanks.
532
And what was all that that whole arc like? and supporting her in this?
533
Well, I mean, I think she's one of the greats and still like developing into how great she's going to be.
534
You know, I'm insecure and she gets that about me and at the same time is like so nurturing to me.
535
And we were kind of playing that part with each other because, you know, in a lot of ways, this could have been disastrous.
536
We're right on the razor's edge.
537
It could easily fall over, you know?
538
And so we both had a lot of fear and insecurity about it.
539
And so we just found ourselves really taking care of each other.
540
But then also all that play.
541
Like Emma laughs, her laugh like travels the world, you know.
542
When she laughs, it comes up to your feet and bubbles up to your body.
543
And the next thing you know, you're just lit up with that.
544
And to have that, you know, every time, every take, we're both sort of laughing and playing and seeing how far we could push it.
545
And turning into these, like, there's just a lot of space to just,
546
it was just very safe between us.
547
And so to turn into these two people, to come back, like, Mark and Emma, and then all of a sudden, you know, become Bella and Duncan.
548
It's great, man.
549
There's such amazing just physical choreography between the two of you the choreo
550
that it seemed like some of it was managed
551
but a lot of it was discovered but you can tell
552
when you have a good dance partner oh yeah it just
553
seemed like you guys really knew how to do the to share the stage
554
and that came a lot from our rehearsal
555
because we were doing all this movement stuff together you know right
556
and so we were moved as a as a troop we're moving as one
557
and then as individuals within
558
that troop we were sort of a lot of it was
559
was getting in the sync was was listening to somebody's body you know so you'd have an exercise where
560
every movement that i made you had to move your arm like that you know so it'd just be like
561
and then turn around and so you someone else is conducting you you know
562
and that that really like that kind of connection it plays you know you pick
563
that up and then you take it with you particularly on the boat in the dining hall
564
that whole sequence which to me in
565
and of itself is like a little one act play it's showing about how you want to be perceived
566
and how she's not playing along
567
and then by the time you're just smacked down on you
568
know all these guys i was like oh my god how much of
569
that really was the stunts or all that stuff was choreographed
570
because some of it felt just like safe chaos it was
571
safe chaos okay we would try to choreograph it with a stunt man
572
and your girls would be like no this this is no no no
573
and he's like what would you what would you you you come in you, what do you do?" And he would ask me and I'd be like, oh, I think this.
574
And he's like, okay, I like that.
575
And what if he gets on you here?
576
And we just sort of made it up.
577
And in the end, there's that kind of tug of war thing.
578
That was just background people, you know, he said, you come in and grab them and you help them and you fight them.
579
And whatever happens, we're going to shoot it.
580
That's why it was a wide shot, you know?
581
And it was, all we knew is that me and her
582
that Duncan and Bella would be doing this tug of war
583
and these guys would try to be pulling us apart
584
and I'd be fighting them off and then coming back
585
and it and it just it was chaos wow
586
but we learned how to be safe with each other
587
and we had the dance which was choreographed
588
but he didn't want it to feel choreographed so every director always says that and then they wind up choreographing it.
589
And he was just adamantly throwing that out.
590
We have our decades of Marvel, which is its own style, right?
591
You have Iron Man, Tony Stark, who is its own style.
592
And it's so different than Strauss.
593
Sure.
594
And how do you make that transition?
595
I mean, and yeah, how do you go about that?
596
Because it takes, I mean, when I see your work in that, I'm like, that is such a disciplined,
597
thoughtful, unique expression of what Robert does,
598
and so different than what he had done up until that point.
599
You know, I've always wondered why you didn't involve him in the Manhattan Project.
600
Greatest scientific mind of our time.
601
I'm going to build on something you've been saying of going back to that kind of like theater camp play, but also knowing the discipline of theaters.
602
You know, sometimes you're doing theater so long that by the time you're doing film,
603
you're too big sometimes you're doing film so long that by the time you're doing theater you're too small
604
um
605
and then sometimes you know what i mean it was always
606
kind of like trying to calibrate just to keep yourself interested
607
and i just remember going this is a lot of words
608
and they're really specific and they're really important
609
so i just went back to like the first time i had to do a one-act play
610
or when i was doing jiva theater in rochester and i was like just get off book
611
and I obsessively went into a mode where I was name rank
612
and serial number if you woke me up in the middle of the night I would know it
613
and the last time I really really did
614
that was for the Iron Man screen test
615
when there were these three scenes
616
that I could have been off book in two days
617
but I just went crazy on them for two
618
and a half months this time I needed the three to five months
619
so I again like theater I started with the words
620
and I knew that I wanted to do enough physically to be different I knew
621
that in black and white getting the right shape would be good
622
and losing the right amount of weight and moving a certain way
623
and again like I know this kind of person I know the political animal
624
and then it's just watching what else is going on like watching Killian like okay that's Mozart
625
so that's what he's doing and I have to be this other thing
626
so it was also great
627
because I got a lot of perspective on you know people
628
through the years coming into play oh the great Tony Stark
629
I mean it's all you know we're all kind of doing the same thing
630
and I I hate it when people poo-poo a genre
631
because they're all hard and they're all high art
632
when they're done well but I just remember
633
that it was the text it was really thinking about he
634
didn't want voices he didn't want accents he didn't want makeup
635
he didn't want anything yeah he wanted the very least amount of interaction with the department heads as possible
636
but even by the time you're going on set they're like
637
filling in my earring hole with uh with stuff just so
638
that you couldn't seeing an extreme close-up because he wouldn't have
639
when i was like god they're really paying attention to detail here
640
so why don't i and it was really framed
641
because you know me i i'm i'm very ectomorphic i don't like to be constrained i know
642
and it's all chris wanted so i thought well this is going to be hard
643
but easy but you back to that discipline it's transformative
644
i didn't see robert downey jr in there i didn't see it and you know i didn't see that
645
And it was so exciting.
646
And it's so interesting because it was that containment.
647
You have the comedy, the movement.
648
I remember every time we worked together, you have props set.
649
You have this.
650
You're moving from there to there to there.
651
It's pop, boom, boom, boom.
652
And it's electrifying.
653
but just for you to just and be that still
654
and I love what you say about learning those lines like
655
that because that's man what a great plan well I mean also in the marvel days like everything might change
656
or we're talking to a tennis ball or I mean you
657
and I the science bros we would have these long passages about absolute gobbledygook
658
but still it's important to us
659
because you know it's part of the characters we didn't know what
660
that was it'd be a little hard to dig in i
661
mean we would just drive each other insane on set going like why can't i retain this
662
but again we know
663
when it's time to tighten things up a little bit um anyway i found great joy in it
664
and it was this 50-year
665
circle of going back to santa fe where i was with my dad
666
when he shot this film called greaser's palace yeah i stayed right 50 steps from the place
667
that i remember the the crew meeting up to you know
668
hang out when we weren't shooting and going
669
and seeing los alamos they didn't actually have any scenes there
670
but shooting in the baton memorial uh building
671
and just going in all these places you know it was all done very practically
672
and i've said this before but it was this moment where we're shooting something in pasadena
673
and and nolan just put this mag of a 70 millimeter
674
i didn't hear that yeah they were changing out mags
675
and he was like hold this and he just put it on my lap
676
and i was just like
677
because you know film yeah i love i will continue to love
678
and i'm happy to eventually in some way re-engage with sci-fi fantasy it's got its own upside but
679
anything that over time takes you further
680
and further away from the experience of just the hardware of what it is we do yeah
681
which is these machines these souls that sensitive metal which
682
which is why it was also beautiful just to be shooting on film, not digital.
683
I got used to digital after Zodiac, because I knew if Fincher's doing it, it's not going away.
684
And is it more efficient?
685
Yes, but you lose those natural rhythms of changing out the mag.
686
And it was just those little times and everyone kind of socialized.
687
And even the clapper loader knew like he was kind of like hitting the brake bell, or if not the brake bell,
688
like running a metronome on the rhythms of this mode of working
689
so it was all
690
that stuff you know you know we have this um we have we have the marvel universe we we have the
691
we we have all of this product that is either already part of something or a brand
692
And then you have Oppenheimer come out, which is completely original kind of source material.
693
And it explodes in a time where people are like really wondering, well, what is cinema now?
694
After Marvel, after franchises, you know, after IP, what is cinema now?
695
And what did you feel and think about that?
696
It's kind of exceptional all looking back now i think about robert pattinson being in tenet
697
which i thought wow it's another great chris nolan movie it
698
happened at the worst possible time there was the fracturing with the studio all this stuff
699
and pattinson gives them unwrap oppenheimer's letters these moments in life
700
where you realize the inception of something occurred in the most organic way and also
701
So Pattinson and Tenet was an incredible departure for him.
702
Yes.
703
So this incredible departure from one of our younger peers turns
704
into him making a personal gift to arguably one of the greatest directors of his generation,
705
turns into him deciding that it's sticking with him.
706
And then I always wonder if something about the organic nature of how something starts
707
and how pure it is
708
and the confidence of the people who bring it forward is uh isn't a great contributor
709
and then there's just that thing zeitgeist whatever you want to call it
710
and honestly i would be every bit as proud
711
if it hadn't broken even or just done pretty good
712
but i think the great thing is it speaks to our taste the audience's taste for novelty
713
and for craftsmanship
714
which is again why i'm telling you i mean poor things
715
is already making a splash as it's on the horizon of coming out
716
and whether this airs
717
but it'll be after people have already seen this i mean
718
you're next buddy that's all i gotta say we'll see well it's it's it's
719
so fantastic thank you yeah some people say i don't know
720
if it'd be forever when i go then Maybe you don't know everyone.
721
Thank you.
📺 같은 채널
B21
Does Sydney Sweeney Know Her Lines?
Daily ConversationUniversity StudentsWorking Adults
B21
Does Travis Scott Know His Lyrics?
Daily ConversationUniversity StudentsWorking Adults
B2Camila Cabello On Mental Health And The Importance Of Self Care
Business EnglishUniversity StudentsWorking Adults
B11
Does Benedict Cumberbatch Know His Lines?
Daily ConversationUniversity StudentsWorking Adults
B22
Jenna Ortega & Elle Fanning | Actors on Actors
Business EnglishDaily ConversationUniversity Students
B12
Noah Schnapp on Coming Out via TikTok & What He Doesn't Like About College | This or That
TeensDaily ConversationUniversity Students
B2Does Miley Cyrus Know 'Hannah Montana' Lyrics?
TeensDaily ConversationHigh School Students
B2Does Tate McRae Know Her Lyrics?
TeensDaily ConversationHigh School Students
B215
Does JENNIE Know Her Lyrics From Her Biggest Songs?
TeensDaily ConversationHigh School Students
B2Jennifer Aniston & Lisa Kudrow | Actors on Actors
Daily ConversationUniversity StudentsWorking Adults
B21
Leonardo DiCaprio & Jennifer Lawrence | Actors on Actors
Daily ConversationUniversity StudentsWorking Adults
B22
Emily Blunt & Anne Hathaway | Actors on Actors
Daily ConversationUniversity StudentsWorking Adults
B2Sadie Sink Talks Her Little Known Singing Skills, 'Stranger Things 5' & Brendan Fraser
TeensDaily ConversationHigh School Students
B2Brad Pitt & Adam Sandler | Actors on Actors - Full Conversation
Daily ConversationUniversity StudentsWorking Adults
✨ 추천 영상
B21
798 문장
Robert Downey Jr. On Living With Intention, Discipline & What Happiness Really Means
Business EnglishDaily ConversationUniversity Students
![Robert De Niro on Acting - Michael Parkinson Interview [1981]](https://img.youtube.com/vi/CUQEiJBRN-Q/mqdefault.jpg)
B21
72 문장
Robert De Niro on Acting - Michael Parkinson Interview [1981]
Daily ConversationUniversity StudentsWorking Adults
B21
582 문장
Cillian Murphy talks OPPENHEIMER, PEAKY BLINDERS, BATMAN, 28 DAYS LATER I Happy Sad Confused
Business EnglishDaily ConversationUniversity Students
B21
418 문장
'Wednesday' Cast Test How Well They Know Each Other | Vanity Fair
Daily ConversationUniversity StudentsWorking Adults
B21
97 문장
Michael B. Jordan Best Actor Press Room Speech | 98th Oscars (2026)
Business EnglishDaily ConversationUniversity Students
B21
297 문장
Chris Hemsworth Takes a Lie Detector Test | Vanity Fair
Daily ConversationUniversity StudentsWorking Adults
B2304 문장
When Rude Interviewers Get Destroyed By Celebrities
Interview EnglishDaily ConversationUniversity Students
![Iron-Man 1 | Tony Meets Christine Everhart Scene | Disney+ [2008]](https://img.youtube.com/vi/3Q5f0QfeMQQ/mqdefault.jpg)
B14
60 문장
Iron-Man 1 | Tony Meets Christine Everhart Scene | Disney+ [2008]
Business EnglishDaily ConversationUniversity Students
B21
871 문장
The Best Johnny Depp Moments | David Letterman
Daily ConversationUniversity StudentsWorking Adults
B22
560 문장
Andy Richter (FULL EPISODE) | Conan O'Brien Needs A Friend
Daily ConversationUniversity StudentsWorking Adults
B21
52 문장
Emily Blunt Talks 'The Devil Wears Prada 2' & The Line Most Quoted Back To Her | The View
Business EnglishDaily ConversationUniversity Students
이 레슨의 어휘와 말하기 포인트
이 영상에는 섀도잉할 문장 721개와 단어 8034개가 있습니다. 말하는 구간의 길이는 50:06입니다. 화자는 분당 약 160단어로, 일상 대화에 가까운 자연스러운 속도로 말합니다. 단어의 85%가 영어에서 가장 많이 쓰이는 3,000단어에 속합니다. 나머지는 연습 전에 미리 확인해 두세요.
이 영상의 핵심 어휘
영상에 나오는 익혀 둘 만한 단어 15개를 발음, 뜻과 함께 정리했습니다.
| 단어 | 발음 | 뜻 |
|---|---|---|
| theater 명사 | /ˈθi(ə)tɚ/ | 극장 |
| script 명사 | /skɹɪpt/ | 문서, 문장 |
| compliment 명사 | /ˈkɑmpləmənt/ | 칭찬, 찬사 |
| genius 명사 | /ˈd͡ʒin.jəs/ | 천재 |
| chaos 명사 | /ˈkeɪˌɑs/ | 혼돈, 카오스 |
| discipline 명사 | /ˈdɪsəplɪn/ | 규율 |
| delete 동사 | /dɪˈliːt/ | 삭제(削除)하다 |
| cinema 명사 | /ˈsɪn.ə.mə/ | 영화관, 극장 |
| embarrassed 형용사 | /ɪmˈbæɹ.əst/ | 부끄럽다 |
| rehearsal 명사 | /ɹɪˈhɝsl̩/ | 리허설, 예행연습 |
| anxiety 명사 | /æŋˈzaɪ.əti/ | 걱정, 불안 |
| nowhere 부사 | /ˈnoʊ.(h)wɛɹ/ | 아무데도 |
| organic 형용사 | /ɔːˈɡænɪk/ | 유기 |
| remind 동사 | /ɹəˈmaɪnd/ | 생각나게 하다, 상기(想起)시키다 |
| humanity 명사 | /hjuˈmænɪti/ | 인류, 인간 |
영상에 나오는 구동사
| 단어 | 발음 | 뜻 |
|---|---|---|
| take off 동사 | 벗다 | |
| come back 동사 | 돌아오다 | |
| come out 동사 | /ˌkʌm ˈaʊt/ | 나오다 |
| go back 동사 | 돌아가다 | |
| go down 동사 | 내려가다 | |
| come up 동사 | 올라오다 | |
| fall over 동사 | 넘어지다 | |
| go away 동사 | 떠나다, 떠나가다 |
이 영상의 문법
화자가 가장 많이 쓰는 문형을 영상 속 실제 표현과 함께 정리했습니다.
| 문형 | 영상 속 표현 |
|---|---|
| 현재완료진행 have/has been + -ing — 전에 시작해 지금도 계속되는 동작 | I've been doing · you've been saying |
| 현재완료 have/has + 과거분사 — 과거의 일이 지금도 관련이 있을 때 | we've done · you've done · have always looked |
| 수동태 be + 과거분사 — 누가 하는지보다 무슨 일이 일어나는지에 초점 | be done · are done · be told |
| 관계절 who / which + 절 — 사람이나 사물에 대한 추가 정보 | guy who was · Yeah, which is · IMAX, which is |
주의할 발음
화자는 you're, don't, I'm 같은 축약형과 약화된 형태를 257번 사용합니다. 들리는 대로 짧게 발음하세요.
- “th” 소리: theater /ˈθi(ə)tɚ/, underneath /ˌʌndɚˈniθ/, grandfather /ˈɡɹæn(d)ˌfɑðɚ/, thoughtful /ˈθɔːtfəl/, bother /ˈbɑðɚ/
- “sh”와 “zh” 소리: conscious /ˈkɑn.ʃəs/, anxious /ˈæŋkʃəs/, splash /splæʃ/, extension /ɪkˈstɛnʃən/, transition /tɹænˈzɪʃ.ən/
- 긴 단어 — 강세 위치에 주의: anxiety /æŋˈzaɪ.əti/, incredibly /ɪŋˈkɹɛdɪbli/, humanity /hjuˈmænɪti/, formidable /ˈfɔɹmɪdəbəl/, ridiculous /ɹɪˈdɪk.jə.ləs/
이 영상으로 연습하는 방법
- 먼저 말하지 않고 영상을 끝까지 듣고 모르는 단어를 적어 둡니다.
- 0.75배속으로 한 문장씩 섀도잉을 시작하고, 익숙해지면 보통 속도로 돌아갑니다.
- 자신의 목소리를 녹음해 원본과 비교하고, theater, script, compliment 같은 단어에 특히 주의합니다.
쉐도잉이란? 영어 실력을 빠르게 키우는 과학적 방법
쉐도잉(Shadowing)은 원래 전문 통역사 훈련을 위해 개발된 언어 학습 기법으로, 다언어 학자인 Dr. Alexander Arguelles에 의해 대중화된 방법입니다. 핵심 원리는 간단하지만 매우 강력합니다: 원어민의 영어를 들으면서 1~2초의 짧은 지연으로 즉시 소리 내어 따라 말하는 것——마치 '그림자(shadow)'처럼 화자를 따라가는 것입니다. 문법 공부나 수동적인 청취와 달리, 쉐도잉은 뇌와 입 근육이 동시에 실시간으로 영어를 처리하고 재현하도록 훈련합니다. 연구에 따르면 이 방법은 발음 정확도, 억양, 리듬, 연음, 청취력, 말하기 유창성을 크게 향상시킵니다. IELTS 스피킹 준비와 자연스러운 영어 소통을 원하는 분들에게 특히 효과적입니다.