Shadowing Practice: BONUS: Should we do PCB or enclosure design first? (Feat Andrew Amirnovin) - Learn English Speaking with Video
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Hi everyone, it's Adrian here from Sophist.
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I've just got another quick bonus podcast episode for you
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because I was having a chat with our head of new product development,
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Andrew, recently about whether you should do PCB or enclosure design first and I wanted to find out what his opinion was.
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Let's get into that.
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Andrew, welcome back.
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Hi.
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Hey, Adrian.
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Good to be here again.
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Glad to have you on.
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And the reason for getting you on this time is because we saw a conversation on the Hardware Academy forum,
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and I'll leave the link to that, listeners, so you can go check it out.
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It's a forum and a website that helps SMEs
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and entrepreneurs to get information and support to bring their new product ideas to life and to market.
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And this conversation was about whether you should do PCB design first or enclosure design first.
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And actually, there was quite a lively conversation about it.
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And some people thought the latter and some people thought the former.
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So I was just hoping to get your feedback on this.
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Where do you stand?
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and also hopefully you can give us some guidance on how to make the decision on
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which way to go I'm assuming of course that this is going to be most relevant to people making
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electromechanical products as well yes absolutely I think this was a very good conversation between a lot of engineers in
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that forum and I think that really nobody got to in any kind of a conclusion
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which way is the right way well to be honest i mean enclosure
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or pcb which one should it be first kind of like chicken neck situation chicken
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and egg situation you know it is really really difficult to decide without knowing much about the product you know if you
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are a design engineer that you just kind of settled in your own ways
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and you always do the pcb design first well you may run into some problems
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when you try to put that pcb in a tighter enclosure that
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that the id team has already you know kind of thought of
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and then you'll have to kind of go backwards
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and split the pcb
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or whatever else you have to do in order to fit it there uh
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and the backwards just the reverse could be possible you know
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if you're a closure designer and you design the enclosure that is small and nothing is going to fit in there,
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then there's going to be a war in the office.
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People are not going to agree with each other.
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And so I think the best way, honestly, is to come up with a process
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that makes it easy for everyone to understand what is the right way to do this?
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What's the, you know, in my opinion, honestly, in some cases, you know,
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designing the PCB first makes a lot of sense, depending on the product.
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And in some cases, building the, you know, enclosure makes a lot of sense because of the fact
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that size and dimensions and the ID is more important than what's inside, for example, or what the user expects, you know,
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imagine if iphone was the size of a tv uh
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if the iphone was the size of a tv gosh i
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mean i don't think anybody would buy an iphone it would be just too big
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and you know if if the enclosure was decided to be
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that big uh so i'm exaggerating of course but um you know everything needs to be
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down to what makes sense for that product, not only in the design office, you know, with the team,
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but also with the customers that we're going to sell this product for.
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If the customers demand a smaller package, then the enclosure is the one that the way that has to go, right?
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You have to design it for enclosure.
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But if enclosure is not so important functionality is important and you need to build a product that really functions well
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then basically you you do the pcb first and and try
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and fit them in a format format or fun or a package
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that uh that fits just about right
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so i i came up with an idea
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that i think might be helpful and not necessarily written on stone steps or process.
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I think it's just an idea to help at least help our young engineers to kind of find their way
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which way should be.
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I call it the five steps of basically,
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you know, the basic design of a brand new product that that doesn't exist
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as much in the industry
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or in the market maybe there is one competitor is just newly uh you know uh is producing one
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or you know in that kind of a scenario is what we're talking about
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well the first step is creating a product requirements document what is called prd
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and typically this comes from I believe product engineering team
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and they kind of design the form fit
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and function of the early product
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and the concept product they they come up it would be
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nice actually they would come up with a user manual as well and preliminary product specification
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maybe a reliability requirement for example
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if it needs to meet a certain for example drop height
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so this PRD would have so much information there
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that would help at least the design team have an idea
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of what the product should be like in terms of specification this could be very useful for PCB designers.
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However, step two would be an ID, industrial design for the product.
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I know that a lot of us have seen on TV, you know, a guy who is designing a car from a wax.
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Have you seen that?
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He's like scraping a little bit more from the front,
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a little bit from the back and reshaping corners and so forth.
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That's basically ID.
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And ID, industrial design of the product, is critical to the success of the product.
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It's kind of like the fashion designer.
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You know, he's trying to make the look and feel of the product be appealing at the same time, functional.
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And it's really a very, very sophisticated area in the engineering.
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And through this idea, it gives the engineering team,
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especially young design team, a good picture in their mind
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and the image of what the product is going to look like at the end
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or what it should be looking like once how it should be designed
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and once you have that this id document should also have a detailed
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or at least rough estimate of dimensions you know length widths height
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and so on and this would help the designer understand okay well
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if it's going to be that big then my pcb needs to be this big roughly,
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you know, so they kind of have an idea what's going on and then where the buttons should be, where the LCD should be and so on.
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So all of that will be an ID design, a look and feel of the final product.
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But the next, also as important, next step is product functionality.
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And that would give a really important point on what's the max operating temperature,
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max operating voltage and current, and how should it operate, for example, you know, if it's a telephone,
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what kind of LCD we want, what kind of features we want on this mobile phone, for example.
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So basically, the functionality would have all the features,
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functionality parameters and perhaps some of the electrical specifications
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or maybe most of the detail electrical specifications in terms of how they should be designed
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and again you know i'm just giving you these ideas they're not written on stone
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and every company dependent on the product they're going to do their side of how they categorize these will be different.
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Maybe electrical specification is under functionality in one company,
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but maybe it's under PRD or user manual in another company.
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So there's no one cookie cut type of categorizing or writing these information.
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But as long as you have these sections identified and discussed within Teams, I think it's going to help a lot.
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Number four, I think, is bill of material is very important.
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Bill of material gives the picture of what kind of components
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and materials need to be used and how they need to be sourced, how many of those are in the, for example, in the product,
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and whether or not the total cost estimate is within the ballpark of the funding
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or estimate of what the project cost should be, initial cost at least.
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So I think that bill of material is important to know something about it.
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And then lastly, step number five is when you're designing a brand new product that perhaps maybe only one,
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you know, competitor has it, it would be good to have a sample of the competitor for competitive analysis
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and or maybe even re-engineering so
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that you can design your product even 10 times better in terms of functionality or design or features.
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Yeah.
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And then also need to get back to your own customer if you're designing for a particular customer,
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understand what the customer requirements are.
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Perhaps customer wants same product in the, you know, in the field,
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but wanted like smaller version or cheaper version or bigger version, you know, you never know.
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So it's very important to understand what really the customer wants.
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Maybe the customer wants an industrial version, which is more robust and reliable, right?
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So no matter what it is, this step is important, because imagine you don't tell your team that this needs to be industrial version,
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and they start developing your product that doesn't even meet industrial version.
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So you, you can ship that product, right?
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So it is an important step in terms of trying to determine, you know, what to do.
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So in my opinion, Adrian, I think if you take these five steps to a meeting
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and have a comprehensive meeting from heads of departments and design and development,
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reliability, you know, purchasing, manufacturing.
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If you have all these heads of the departments there and you're going through these, you're saying, okay, we have a brand new product that we need to design.
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Where should we start?
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Well, knowing these steps and knowing these information,
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not necessarily following these steps in the manner I mentioned, it can be mixed up or it doesn't matter which one is first,
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just having these information for each area and knowing what the product is going to look like.
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And in engineering, sometimes we call it form and fit
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and function of the product if you know
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that you'll have a big idea or big picture of the product
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and then you can easily decide and brainstorm should we start with pcb first
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or the enclosures i think at
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that time it will be clear do you agree yeah i do
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and i think the point that you made about validating it as well for your potential customer is important because
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this is all about reducing risks right you're reducing the risks of bringing out product
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that people aren't going to want to buy you're reducing the risks of overruns in terms of time because
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if something has to be changed that's going to be that's
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going to take time you're reducing the risks of cost overruns as well
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because changes certainly the closer you get to production it's It's going to be more costly.
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So being organized and having that basis of information and those five points that you've mentioned are really, really helpful for that will help you to choose the right thing at the right time.
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So you don't want to end up making an enclosure, going through all of the time and expense to design it, start producing it, and then it's too small, for example.
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Right, right.
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Exactly.
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I mean, if you imagine if you start with enclosure and too small, well, for sure, those PCBs are not fitting there.
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And then on the other hand, if the enclosure is supposed to be small, then there should be a good communication with the PCB team
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that the typical way of designing the PCB is not going to work.
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It's just we need to come up with a ways of really small, maybe flex cables instead of, you know, if the product is small, like a digital watch, for example.
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so so there are other ways that other technologies
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that they're more miniature you're the many layers to each one of these pcbs
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so there are ways of doing these things
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but you just have to i think the rule number one
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is communication among teams between cross-functional teams you definitely have to have very good communication
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and i think that project managers
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and the product engineers who are trying to launch this brand new product they need to be a good communicator
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but also really need to manage the teams in a way that they understand that you know if the prod
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enclosure needs to be go uh designed first then let's go with that let's not stick to
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what you learned in another company uh necessarily uh maybe brainstorm and come up with
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an innovative new process yeah great that's uh that's very very helpful
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and hopefully that puts people's minds at rest if if they're wondering well pcb first or enclosure first but i suppose
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in a nutshell it depends it does excellent guidance there andrew thanks for popping by
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and yeah hopefully we'll get you on again soon thanks adrian
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talk to you later thanks again for listening to this podcast
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brought to you by the sophie's group we're on a mission
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to provide you with everything you need to manufacture effectively in asia including inspections auditing new product development support,
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contract manufacturing, 3PL warehousing and fulfilment, and much, much more across Asia's key manufacturing areas.
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Visit us at sophist.com, that's S-O-F-E-A-S-T.com to learn more and get help.
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If you've enjoyed the podcast today, please do rate, review and share because it will really help others discover us too.
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Vocabulary and speaking notes for this lesson
This video has 178 sentences and 2396 words to shadow. The speech runs for 16:42. The speaker talks at a steady 144 words per minute, a comfortable pace for shadowing. 87% of the words are among the 3,000 most common in English, so the vocabulary is easy to follow.
Key vocabulary in this video
15 less common words from the video, with pronunciation and meaning:
- enclosure /ɛnˈkloʊʒəɹ/ (noun) — Something that is enclosed, i.e. inserted into a letter or similar package.
- functionality (noun) — The ability to do a task, performance, or execution; a set of functions that something is able or equipped to perform.
- specification (noun) — An explicit set of requirements to be satisfied by a material, product, or service.
- designer /dɪˈzaɪnɚ/ (noun) — A person who designs something, or who designs things as a profession.
- necessarily /ˌnɛs.əˈsɛɹ.ə.li/ (adverb) — Inevitably; of necessity.
- helpful /ˈhɛlp.fl̩/ (adjective) — Furnishing help; giving aid; useful.
- electrical /ɪˈlɛktɹɪkəl/ (adjective) — Related to electricity (or electronics)
- forum /ˈfɔːɹəm/ (noun) — A place for discussion.
- estimate /ˈɛs.tɪ.mət/ (noun) — A rough calculation or assessment of the value, size, or cost of something.
- requirement /ɹɪˈkwaɪɹmənt/ (noun) — A necessity or prerequisite; something required or obligatory. Its adpositions are generally of in relation to who or what has given it, on in relation to whom…
- podcast /ˈpɑdˌkæst/ (noun) — A program, especially an audio program, produced on a regular basis, delivered over the Internet in a compressed digital format and designed for playback on…
- competitor /kəmˈpɛt.ɪ.tɚ/ (noun) — A person or organization against whom one is competing.
- format /ˈfɔːɹ.mæt/ (noun) — The layout of a publication or document.
- package /ˈpæk.ɪd͡ʒ/ (noun) — Something which is packed, a parcel, a box, an envelope.
- guidance /ˈɡaɪdəns/ (noun) — The act or process of guiding.
Phrasal verbs you will hear
- come up with (verb) — To manage to produce, deliver, or present (something) by inventing, creating, thinking of, or obtaining it.
- go through (verb) — To travel from one end of something to the other.
- step in (verb) — To act as a replacement or substitute.
- bring out (verb) — To elicit, evoke, or emphasize (a particular quality).
- come from (verb) — To have as one's origin, birthplace or nationality.
- come up (verb) — To emerge or become known, especially unexpectedly.
- do in (verb) — To kill or end; to defeat.
- end up (verb) — To bring to a conclusion.
Pronunciation to watch
The speaker uses 33 contractions and reduced forms, such as you're, they're, doesn't. Say them the short way, as you hear them.
- The “sh” and “zh” sounds: enclosure /ɛnˈkloʊʒəɹ/, dimension /daɪˈmɛn.ʃən/, conclusion /kənˈkluːʒən/, inspection /ɪnˈspɛkʃən/, closure /ˈkloʊ.ʒɚ/
- Long words — get the stress right: necessarily /ˌnɛs.əˈsɛɹ.ə.li/, electrical /ɪˈlɛktɹɪkəl/, competitor /kəmˈpɛt.ɪ.tɚ/, comprehensive /ˌkɑm.pɹəˈhɛn.sɪv/, preliminary /pɹɪˈlɪmɪnɛɹi/
How to practise with this video
- Listen to the whole video once without speaking and note the words you do not know.
- Shadow it sentence by sentence at normal speed, repeating each one until your rhythm matches the speaker.
- Record yourself and compare with the original, paying attention to words like enclosure, functionality, specification.
Grammar in this video
The structures the speaker uses most, with the exact words from the video:
| Structure | In the video |
|---|---|
| Passive voice be + past participle — the focus is on what happens, not who does it | was decided · is called · should be designed |
| Present perfect have/has + past participle — a past action that still matters now | have seen · Have you seen · you've mentioned |
| Relative clauses who / which + clause — extra information about a person or thing | guy who is · version, which is |
What is the Shadowing Technique?
Shadowing is a science-backed language learning technique originally developed for professional interpreter training and popularized by polyglot Dr. Alexander Arguelles. The method is simple but powerful: you listen to native English audio and immediately repeat it out loud — like a shadow following the speaker with just a 1–2 second delay. Unlike passive listening or grammar drills, shadowing forces your brain and mouth muscles to simultaneously process and reproduce real speech patterns. Research shows it significantly improves pronunciation accuracy, intonation, rhythm, connected speech, listening comprehension, and speaking fluency — making it one of the most effective methods for IELTS Speaking preparation and real-world English communication.